Auto-Boot Cost me ~3 hours work - Thx & Farewell MS!

This is a message about the *stupidest* feature I have ever come across in my
very long experience as a computer user. I'd like to have a chat with the
clueless geeks who allowed it:

I came back to my computer in the morning to continue some work that was
open in a Mathcad session when I left it. After I logged on to an empty
desktop, WU informed me with one of those little balloons in the lower right
that it had kindly installed an update and was considerate enough to reboot.

I looked at my choices for WU and I had certainly selected automatic updates
as recommended, but I could find nothing in the help or explanations that
stated that reboot would happen without notice.

If you're thinking "you should have saved your work", well maybe I should
have, but you're totally missing the point. I don't expect my tools to stop
working arbitrarily while I'm not looking. If you leave a bucket of paint at
the top of a ladder, you don't expect the ladder to fold up by itself while
you step away to go to the bathroom.

I've put up reluctantly for many years with the condescending, "don't worry
I know what's best for you" personification MS has imbued this OS with and
this is the last straw. I only wish that I could install Mac OS on this IBM
laptop. I'm just hoping that Linux will install.

When you say that you had left a session open in MathCad - do you mean that
you had a Citrix or Terminal Service session open to a published MathCad
session, or the computer was left on, and MathCad was installed locally and
was running?

Is this computer a shared (i.e. school) lab computer that is maintained by a
support group?

Rob

"astro" <> wrote in message
news:00CB8AF6-E174-42FE-B9C7-...
> This is a message about the *stupidest* feature I have ever come across in
> my
> very long experience as a computer user. I'd like to have a chat with the
> clueless geeks who allowed it:
>
> I came back to my computer in the morning to continue some work that was
> open in a Mathcad session when I left it. After I logged on to an empty
> desktop, WU informed me with one of those little balloons in the lower
> right
> that it had kindly installed an update and was considerate enough to
> reboot.
>
> I looked at my choices for WU and I had certainly selected automatic
> updates
> as recommended, but I could find nothing in the help or explanations that
> stated that reboot would happen without notice.
>
> If you're thinking "you should have saved your work", well maybe I should
> have, but you're totally missing the point. I don't expect my tools to
> stop
> working arbitrarily while I'm not looking. If you leave a bucket of paint
> at
> the top of a ladder, you don't expect the ladder to fold up by itself
> while
> you step away to go to the bathroom.
>
> I've put up reluctantly for many years with the condescending, "don't
> worry
> I know what's best for you" personification MS has imbued this OS with and
> this is the last straw. I only wish that I could install Mac OS on this
> IBM
> laptop. I'm just hoping that Linux will install.

Thanks for your interest...

"maximillianx" wrote:

> When you say that you had left a session open in MathCad - do you mean that
> you had a Citrix or Terminal Service session open to a published MathCad
> session, or the computer was left on, and MathCad was installed locally and
> was running?

Installed locally and running

>
> Is this computer a shared (i.e. school) lab computer that is maintained by a
> support group?
>

Nope, it's mine, I simply use a firewalled sub-network at work and I am the
only administrator on my computer and my password is very well-constructed
and protected. Maybe I got hacked or CAD'd by someone but I am convinced this
is a feature. Anyway, here are some other notable things:

1. My login screen said I had 5 mail messages waiting (my mail was open when
I left it as well), but no mail program was open when I logged in.


2. I got a notification icon/bubble on the task bar that WU had re-booted to
install the updates.

3. Before I posted, I found another post from someone who wanted to enable
automatic updates without auto-boot. (I haven't time to find it again - sorry)

> Rob
>
> "astro" <> wrote in message
> news:00CB8AF6-E174-42FE-B9C7-...
> > This is a message about the *stupidest* feature I have ever come across in
> > my
> > very long experience as a computer user. I'd like to have a chat with the
> > clueless geeks who allowed it:
> >
> > I came back to my computer in the morning to continue some work that was
> > open in a Mathcad session when I left it. After I logged on to an empty
> > desktop, WU informed me with one of those little balloons in the lower
> > right
> > that it had kindly installed an update and was considerate enough to
> > reboot.
> >
> > I looked at my choices for WU and I had certainly selected automatic
> > updates
> > as recommended, but I could find nothing in the help or explanations that
> > stated that reboot would happen without notice.
> >
> > If you're thinking "you should have saved your work", well maybe I should
> > have, but you're totally missing the point. I don't expect my tools to
> > stop
> > working arbitrarily while I'm not looking. If you leave a bucket of paint
> > at
> > the top of a ladder, you don't expect the ladder to fold up by itself
> > while
> > you step away to go to the bathroom.
> >
> > I've put up reluctantly for many years with the condescending, "don't
> > worry
> > I know what's best for you" personification MS has imbued this OS with and
> > this is the last straw. I only wish that I could install Mac OS on this
> > IBM
> > laptop. I'm just hoping that Linux will install.
>
>
>

> Nope, it's mine, I simply use a firewalled sub-network at work and I am
> the
> only administrator on my computer and my password is very well-constructed
> and protected. Maybe I got hacked or CAD'd by someone but I am convinced
> this
> is a feature. Anyway, here are some other notable things:
>
> 1. My login screen said I had 5 mail messages waiting (my mail was open
> when
> I left it as well), but no mail program was open when I logged in.

This isn't uncommon - Windows saves this information in a registry key, so
even if your email is closed, it will report back the information to Windows
(http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=304148)

> 2. I got a notification icon/bubble on the task bar that WU had re-booted
> to
> install the updates.

Check your automatic updates settings in the control panel and report back
your findings here -

> 3. Before I posted, I found another post from someone who wanted to enable
> automatic updates without auto-boot. (I haven't time to find it again -
> sorry)

Yes, you can configure automatic updates in your control panel to download
(and not install) windows updates. Then, after your system downloads new
updates, you should get a balloon notification saying "newly downloaded
upates are ready to install" or something along those lines.

Then, you can install when YOU are ready to reboot.

Hope this helps!

Regards,
Rob

Thanks agiain for your interest and help. I know that there is an
alternative, but here's the bottom line:

The problem is THIS: When you choose automatic install, it also ENABLES
AUTO-BOOT WITHOUT TELLING THE POOR USER. I was not warned of this when I
chose the option, the description by the radio button doesn't mention this
AND it is not to be found in the "How does Automatic Updates work?" link.

Again, thanks for the help and feel free to keep the thread going without
me. It might be helpful to someone, a user, or maybe MS developers who might
decide to fix it. I'll not be participating because I won't be using Windows
for much longer because of this last in a long series of needless, negative
experiences with it over the past 14 years. There are now alternatives - I
don't have to suffer with it any longer.


"maximillianx" wrote:

> > Nope, it's mine, I simply use a firewalled sub-network at work and I am
> > the
> > only administrator on my computer and my password is very well-constructed
> > and protected. Maybe I got hacked or CAD'd by someone but I am convinced
> > this
> > is a feature. Anyway, here are some other notable things:
> >
> > 1. My login screen said I had 5 mail messages waiting (my mail was open
> > when
> > I left it as well), but no mail program was open when I logged in.
>
> This isn't uncommon - Windows saves this information in a registry key, so
> even if your email is closed, it will report back the information to Windows
> (http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=304148)
>
> > 2. I got a notification icon/bubble on the task bar that WU had re-booted
> > to
> > install the updates.
>
> Check your automatic updates settings in the control panel and report back
> your findings here -
>
> > 3. Before I posted, I found another post from someone who wanted to enable
> > automatic updates without auto-boot. (I haven't time to find it again -
> > sorry)
>
> Yes, you can configure automatic updates in your control panel to download
> (and not install) windows updates. Then, after your system downloads new
> updates, you should get a balloon notification saying "newly downloaded
> upates are ready to install" or something along those lines.
>
> Then, you can install when YOU are ready to reboot.
>
> Hope this helps!
>
> Regards,
> Rob
>
>
>

The auto-boot feature is part of the update - when the Windows Update agent
downloads the update metadata, part of it includes information telling the
computer whether a reboot is required or not.

The biggest issue for you it seems is that your Windows Updates are
configured to download and install automatically. For your scenario, I
recommend setting it to 'download updates for me, but let me choose when to
install them.' That way, you are prompted when updates are ready, but you
make the choice to install (and then reboot afterward so you don't get that
reminder dialog).

The best thing that any Windows user could do is expect that a restart is
necessary after Windows Updates are applied. While this may not be true for
all updates, it is just best to use this mentality - once new updates are
downloaded, you can install Windows Updates according to your time when you
know that you aren't in the middle of a big project...

For other readers of this thread, you should educate yourself on the
behavior of your Windows Update agent on your computer.

When the new update agent installs automatically from the Windows Update
site, you get a message box that appears asking how you would like to
configure your Windows Update agent - i.e. download automatically at 3:00am
and install (default setting), download and prompt for user to install
(preferred for most home users), or disable automatic updates (meaning you
would have to go to the Windows Updates website to get any new updates).

You can invoke this screen this by running 'wuauclt.exe
/showsettingsdialog'.

Astro, I understand your frustration with this issue - but your solution can
be as simple as just tweaking your settings so your Windows Updates aren't
interrupting your work. There are plenty of ways to do this (including
stopping the automatic updates service temporarily until you are ready for
updates), so you aren't really forced to apply updates according to MS'
default settings.

I don't know what kind of work you do, but you may become more frustrated
switching operating systems than you are with the updates. With that being
said, if you are familiar with other OS's, you will probably be OK - this is
not something that 90% of the computer using community can do easily tho'

With that, I wish you best of luck in whatever you do decide to do!

Regards
Rob



"astro" <> wrote in message
news:E095D2B4-E351-4CB5-8A13-...
> Thanks agiain for your interest and help. I know that there is an
> alternative, but here's the bottom line:
>
> The problem is THIS: When you choose automatic install, it also ENABLES
> AUTO-BOOT WITHOUT TELLING THE POOR USER. I was not warned of this when I
> chose the option, the description by the radio button doesn't mention this
> AND it is not to be found in the "How does Automatic Updates work?" link.
>
> Again, thanks for the help and feel free to keep the thread going without
> me. It might be helpful to someone, a user, or maybe MS developers who
> might
> decide to fix it. I'll not be participating because I won't be using
> Windows
> for much longer because of this last in a long series of needless,
> negative
> experiences with it over the past 14 years. There are now alternatives - I
> don't have to suffer with it any longer.
>

Astro:
The problem is even more insidious than you suppose. While trying to reply
to you, my machine auto-booted. The dialog box stating that a re-boot was
necessary had appeared at least twice in the particular session; and I had
chosen restart later both times. Apparently, while getting onto the internet
and threading my way through the Microsoft Update site, it had reappeared but
had been immediately covered by some action I was in the process of
taking....so I never saw it. The 5 minute timer then took the machine into
restart....Auto-Boot as you call it.

I was on the Microsoft site looking for a note such as yours because a
situation similar to the one you describe happened to me. Hours of work lost
because of an office urgency that called me away from the machine long enough
for the Auto-Boot timer to appear and runout.

I agree. This is intolerable and unacceptable.

Does anyone know how Auto-Boot can be turned off? I haven't been able to
find the swithch.

Now a second, possibly related issue. Since installing SP2, whenever I open
Powerpoint I find that the autorecovery capability has been turned OFF! I've
reset it and gone in and out of Powerpoint; and on every re-entry the
autorecovery feature is indeed turned off. This means that not only am I at
risk for Auto-Boot restarting me without warning (see above) but AutoRecovery
in Powerpoint may have been turned off!

These can't be the only glitches in SP2. Let's get this to Microsoft, pronto.

entropy



"astro" wrote:

> This is a message about the *stupidest* feature I have ever come across in my
> very long experience as a computer user. I'd like to have a chat with the
> clueless geeks who allowed it:
>
> I came back to my computer in the morning to continue some work that was
> open in a Mathcad session when I left it. After I logged on to an empty
> desktop, WU informed me with one of those little balloons in the lower right
> that it had kindly installed an update and was considerate enough to reboot.
>
> I looked at my choices for WU and I had certainly selected automatic updates
> as recommended, but I could find nothing in the help or explanations that
> stated that reboot would happen without notice.
>
> If you're thinking "you should have saved your work", well maybe I should
> have, but you're totally missing the point. I don't expect my tools to stop
> working arbitrarily while I'm not looking. If you leave a bucket of paint at
> the top of a ladder, you don't expect the ladder to fold up by itself while
> you step away to go to the bathroom.
>
> I've put up reluctantly for many years with the condescending, "don't worry
> I know what's best for you" personification MS has imbued this OS with and
> this is the last straw. I only wish that I could install Mac OS on this IBM
> laptop. I'm just hoping that Linux will install.