Getting at the crux of the update/installer/access denied bs

So, while having to keep fishing for the answers, at least a direction has
been revealed by some of the ms-mvp's here.
I think they could have gotten here faster if they would detach themselves
from the canned KB*** error #s.


So, I have discovered that for all hives (except one), I have four user
groups:

Administrators (TOMS\Administrators)
CREATOR OWNER
SYSTEM
Users (TOMS\Users)

For all hives with these groups listed, except for HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT, all
groups have full access.
For this group, Users does not have Full Control and I'm apparently logged
on as a User, so I cannot do anything with anything that changes those keys.

Now, this should mean one of two things:
- I was always logged in before as an Administrator
- Users had full control

"and" a December 13th update changed this.
I am not sure which.

There is a catch (of course).
While in the middle of my 50 hours on the phone with support, I logged in as
an Administrator and still had the Access Denied issue with Windows
Installer 3.1 after it was forced.


So, while I thought I was onto something, I think it's another dead end.

Unless someone has gotten past this?

Any additional clues, input, etc. on these statements?

Thanks,
Tom

changing perms had no affect.

I give up.

Wouldn't it be a hoot if you read the news one day and the cause of all this
was because Firefox was installed on the machine? LMFAO

I think I'm really going to switch to SUSE 10.0

Life's too short



"Tom" <> wrote in message
news:...
> So, while having to keep fishing for the answers, at least a direction has
> been revealed by some of the ms-mvp's here.
> I think they could have gotten here faster if they would detach themselves
> from the canned KB*** error #s.
>
>
> So, I have discovered that for all hives (except one), I have four user
> groups:
>
> Administrators (TOMS\Administrators)
> CREATOR OWNER
> SYSTEM
> Users (TOMS\Users)
>
> For all hives with these groups listed, except for HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT, all
> groups have full access.
> For this group, Users does not have Full Control and I'm apparently logged
> on as a User, so I cannot do anything with anything that changes those
> keys.
>
> Now, this should mean one of two things:
> - I was always logged in before as an Administrator
> - Users had full control
>
> "and" a December 13th update changed this.
> I am not sure which.
>
> There is a catch (of course).
> While in the middle of my 50 hours on the phone with support, I logged in
> as an Administrator and still had the Access Denied issue with Windows
> Installer 3.1 after it was forced.
>
>
> So, while I thought I was onto something, I think it's another dead end.
>
>
> Unless someone has gotten past this?
>
> Any additional clues, input, etc. on these statements?
>
> Thanks,
> Tom
>

As MS customers, we demand a fix that sets all reg and file perms back to
what they were before the last "security" updates.


"Tom" <> wrote in message
news:...
> So, while having to keep fishing for the answers, at least a direction has
> been revealed by some of the ms-mvp's here.
> I think they could have gotten here faster if they would detach themselves
> from the canned KB*** error #s.
>
>
> So, I have discovered that for all hives (except one), I have four user
> groups:
>
> Administrators (TOMS\Administrators)
> CREATOR OWNER
> SYSTEM
> Users (TOMS\Users)
>
> For all hives with these groups listed, except for HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT, all
> groups have full access.
> For this group, Users does not have Full Control and I'm apparently logged
> on as a User, so I cannot do anything with anything that changes those
> keys.
>
> Now, this should mean one of two things:
> - I was always logged in before as an Administrator
> - Users had full control
>
> "and" a December 13th update changed this.
> I am not sure which.
>
> There is a catch (of course).
> While in the middle of my 50 hours on the phone with support, I logged in
> as an Administrator and still had the Access Denied issue with Windows
> Installer 3.1 after it was forced.
>
>
> So, while I thought I was onto something, I think it's another dead end.
>
>
> Unless someone has gotten past this?
>
> Any additional clues, input, etc. on these statements?
>
> Thanks,
> Tom
>

"Tom" <> wrote in message
news:...
> So, while having to keep fishing for the answers, at least a direction has
> been revealed by some of the ms-mvp's here.
> I think they could have gotten here faster if they would detach themselves
> from the canned KB*** error #s.
>
>
> So, I have discovered that for all hives (except one), I have four user
> groups:
>
> Administrators (TOMS\Administrators)
> CREATOR OWNER
> SYSTEM
> Users (TOMS\Users)
>
> For all hives with these groups listed, except for HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT, all
> groups have full access.
> For this group, Users does not have Full Control and I'm apparently logged
> on as a User, so I cannot do anything with anything that changes those keys.
>
> Now, this should mean one of two things:
> - I was always logged in before as an Administrator
> - Users had full control


I noticed in one of your other posts that you are using the MU agent.

When did you install MU? E.g. if that is when you switched from using
WUv4 to WUv6 you could be seeing a problem with WUv6 or that agent.
FYI in both WUv5 and WUv6 the user's account is not the only criterion
for permissions. So the message you are getting then might be for the
other account(s) which are being used.

This is the kind of detail which concurrent tracing by FileMon and RegMon
could help clarify.

BTW so far you have given us very few details to work with.
For example, I haven't seen in all your posts even which OS
and maintenance level your problem machine is using.
You seem to be posting from XPsp2 with no other maintenance.
In that case you were probably using WUv5 earlier so the point
about permissions for multiple accounts won't be a simple binary
factor but I still think it is one worth investigating.


HTH

Robert Aldwinckle
---


>
> "and" a December 13th update changed this.
> I am not sure which.
>
> There is a catch (of course).
> While in the middle of my 50 hours on the phone with support, I logged in as
> an Administrator and still had the Access Denied issue with Windows
> Installer 3.1 after it was forced.
>
>
> So, while I thought I was onto something, I think it's another dead end.
>
> Unless someone has gotten past this?
>
> Any additional clues, input, etc. on these statements?
>
> Thanks,
> Tom
>
>

SP2, with all updates before dec 13

I have worked for 50 hours on the phone with ms, so I can't list all of
that.

XP Home

I can't get updates, so I can't tell you which updater.
I did not install mu, if it's there, it came as update on autoud...

thnx


"Robert Aldwinckle" <> wrote in message
news:...
> "Tom" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>> So, while having to keep fishing for the answers, at least a direction
>> has
>> been revealed by some of the ms-mvp's here.
>> I think they could have gotten here faster if they would detach
>> themselves
>> from the canned KB*** error #s.
>>
>>
>> So, I have discovered that for all hives (except one), I have four user
>> groups:
>>
>> Administrators (TOMS\Administrators)
>> CREATOR OWNER
>> SYSTEM
>> Users (TOMS\Users)
>>
>> For all hives with these groups listed, except for HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT, all
>> groups have full access.
>> For this group, Users does not have Full Control and I'm apparently
>> logged
>> on as a User, so I cannot do anything with anything that changes those
>> keys.
>>
>> Now, this should mean one of two things:
>> - I was always logged in before as an Administrator
>> - Users had full control
>
>
> I noticed in one of your other posts that you are using the MU agent.
>
> When did you install MU? E.g. if that is when you switched from using
> WUv4 to WUv6 you could be seeing a problem with WUv6 or that agent.
> FYI in both WUv5 and WUv6 the user's account is not the only criterion
> for permissions. So the message you are getting then might be for the
> other account(s) which are being used.
>
> This is the kind of detail which concurrent tracing by FileMon and
> RegMon
> could help clarify.
>
> BTW so far you have given us very few details to work with.
> For example, I haven't seen in all your posts even which OS
> and maintenance level your problem machine is using.
> You seem to be posting from XPsp2 with no other maintenance.
> In that case you were probably using WUv5 earlier so the point
> about permissions for multiple accounts won't be a simple binary
> factor but I still think it is one worth investigating.
>
>
> HTH
>
> Robert Aldwinckle
> ---
>
>
>>
>> "and" a December 13th update changed this.
>> I am not sure which.
>>
>> There is a catch (of course).
>> While in the middle of my 50 hours on the phone with support, I logged in
>> as
>> an Administrator and still had the Access Denied issue with Windows
>> Installer 3.1 after it was forced.
>>
>>
>> So, while I thought I was onto something, I think it's another dead end.
>>
>>
>> Unless someone has gotten past this?
>>
>> Any additional clues, input, etc. on these statements?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Tom
>>
>>
>
>
>

it takes me to ud 6

also, I havbe no clue what regmon or filemon are, nor should I need to.


"Robert Aldwinckle" <> wrote in message
news:...
> "Tom" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>> So, while having to keep fishing for the answers, at least a direction
>> has
>> been revealed by some of the ms-mvp's here.
>> I think they could have gotten here faster if they would detach
>> themselves
>> from the canned KB*** error #s.
>>
>>
>> So, I have discovered that for all hives (except one), I have four user
>> groups:
>>
>> Administrators (TOMS\Administrators)
>> CREATOR OWNER
>> SYSTEM
>> Users (TOMS\Users)
>>
>> For all hives with these groups listed, except for HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT, all
>> groups have full access.
>> For this group, Users does not have Full Control and I'm apparently
>> logged
>> on as a User, so I cannot do anything with anything that changes those
>> keys.
>>
>> Now, this should mean one of two things:
>> - I was always logged in before as an Administrator
>> - Users had full control
>
>
> I noticed in one of your other posts that you are using the MU agent.
>
> When did you install MU? E.g. if that is when you switched from using
> WUv4 to WUv6 you could be seeing a problem with WUv6 or that agent.
> FYI in both WUv5 and WUv6 the user's account is not the only criterion
> for permissions. So the message you are getting then might be for the
> other account(s) which are being used.
>
> This is the kind of detail which concurrent tracing by FileMon and
> RegMon
> could help clarify.
>
> BTW so far you have given us very few details to work with.
> For example, I haven't seen in all your posts even which OS
> and maintenance level your problem machine is using.
> You seem to be posting from XPsp2 with no other maintenance.
> In that case you were probably using WUv5 earlier so the point
> about permissions for multiple accounts won't be a simple binary
> factor but I still think it is one worth investigating.
>
>
> HTH
>
> Robert Aldwinckle
> ---
>
>
>>
>> "and" a December 13th update changed this.
>> I am not sure which.
>>
>> There is a catch (of course).
>> While in the middle of my 50 hours on the phone with support, I logged in
>> as
>> an Administrator and still had the Access Denied issue with Windows
>> Installer 3.1 after it was forced.
>>
>>
>> So, while I thought I was onto something, I think it's another dead end.
>>
>>
>> Unless someone has gotten past this?
>>
>> Any additional clues, input, etc. on these statements?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Tom
>>
>>
>
>
>

ROFL...

You'd better start learning some of this stuff, troll.


"Tom" <> wrote in message
news:...
> it takes me to ud 6
>
> also, I havbe no clue what regmon or filemon are, nor should I need to.
>
>
> "Robert Aldwinckle" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>> "Tom" <> wrote in message
>> news:...
>>> So, while having to keep fishing for the answers, at least a direction
>>> has
>>> been revealed by some of the ms-mvp's here.
>>> I think they could have gotten here faster if they would detach
>>> themselves
>>> from the canned KB*** error #s.
>>>
>>>
>>> So, I have discovered that for all hives (except one), I have four user
>>> groups:
>>>
>>> Administrators (TOMS\Administrators)
>>> CREATOR OWNER
>>> SYSTEM
>>> Users (TOMS\Users)
>>>
>>> For all hives with these groups listed, except for HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT,
>>> all
>>> groups have full access.
>>> For this group, Users does not have Full Control and I'm apparently
>>> logged
>>> on as a User, so I cannot do anything with anything that changes those
>>> keys.
>>>
>>> Now, this should mean one of two things:
>>> - I was always logged in before as an Administrator
>>> - Users had full control
>>
>>
>> I noticed in one of your other posts that you are using the MU agent.
>>
>> When did you install MU? E.g. if that is when you switched from using
>> WUv4 to WUv6 you could be seeing a problem with WUv6 or that agent.
>> FYI in both WUv5 and WUv6 the user's account is not the only criterion
>> for permissions. So the message you are getting then might be for the
>> other account(s) which are being used.
>>
>> This is the kind of detail which concurrent tracing by FileMon and
>> RegMon
>> could help clarify.
>>
>> BTW so far you have given us very few details to work with.
>> For example, I haven't seen in all your posts even which OS
>> and maintenance level your problem machine is using.
>> You seem to be posting from XPsp2 with no other maintenance.
>> In that case you were probably using WUv5 earlier so the point
>> about permissions for multiple accounts won't be a simple binary
>> factor but I still think it is one worth investigating.
>>
>>
>> HTH
>>
>> Robert Aldwinckle
>> ---
>>
>>
>>>
>>> "and" a December 13th update changed this.
>>> I am not sure which.
>>>
>>> There is a catch (of course).
>>> While in the middle of my 50 hours on the phone with support, I logged
>>> in as
>>> an Administrator and still had the Access Denied issue with Windows
>>> Installer 3.1 after it was forced.
>>>
>>>
>>> So, while I thought I was onto something, I think it's another dead end.
>>>
>>>
>>> Unless someone has gotten past this?
>>>
>>> Any additional clues, input, etc. on these statements?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Tom
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

f-off thata is NOT my job nor should it be.

I can clearly see the path to be able to do my job is deploy Linux and
suggest my employer and the millions in Usent in high tech do the same.


"Tom [Pepper] Willett" <> wrote in message
news:OxnPoC%...
> ROFL...
>
> You'd better start learning some of this stuff, troll.
>
>
> "Tom" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>> it takes me to ud 6
>>
>> also, I havbe no clue what regmon or filemon are, nor should I need to.
>>
>>
>> "Robert Aldwinckle" <> wrote in message
>> news:...
>>> "Tom" <> wrote in message
>>> news:...
>>>> So, while having to keep fishing for the answers, at least a direction
>>>> has
>>>> been revealed by some of the ms-mvp's here.
>>>> I think they could have gotten here faster if they would detach
>>>> themselves
>>>> from the canned KB*** error #s.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So, I have discovered that for all hives (except one), I have four user
>>>> groups:
>>>>
>>>> Administrators (TOMS\Administrators)
>>>> CREATOR OWNER
>>>> SYSTEM
>>>> Users (TOMS\Users)
>>>>
>>>> For all hives with these groups listed, except for HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT,
>>>> all
>>>> groups have full access.
>>>> For this group, Users does not have Full Control and I'm apparently
>>>> logged
>>>> on as a User, so I cannot do anything with anything that changes those
>>>> keys.
>>>>
>>>> Now, this should mean one of two things:
>>>> - I was always logged in before as an Administrator
>>>> - Users had full control
>>>
>>>
>>> I noticed in one of your other posts that you are using the MU agent.
>>>
>>> When did you install MU? E.g. if that is when you switched from
>>> using
>>> WUv4 to WUv6 you could be seeing a problem with WUv6 or that agent.
>>> FYI in both WUv5 and WUv6 the user's account is not the only criterion
>>> for permissions. So the message you are getting then might be for the
>>> other account(s) which are being used.
>>>
>>> This is the kind of detail which concurrent tracing by FileMon and
>>> RegMon
>>> could help clarify.
>>>
>>> BTW so far you have given us very few details to work with.
>>> For example, I haven't seen in all your posts even which OS
>>> and maintenance level your problem machine is using.
>>> You seem to be posting from XPsp2 with no other maintenance.
>>> In that case you were probably using WUv5 earlier so the point
>>> about permissions for multiple accounts won't be a simple binary
>>> factor but I still think it is one worth investigating.
>>>
>>>
>>> HTH
>>>
>>> Robert Aldwinckle
>>> ---
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "and" a December 13th update changed this.
>>>> I am not sure which.
>>>>
>>>> There is a catch (of course).
>>>> While in the middle of my 50 hours on the phone with support, I logged
>>>> in as
>>>> an Administrator and still had the Access Denied issue with Windows
>>>> Installer 3.1 after it was forced.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So, while I thought I was onto something, I think it's another dead
>>>> end.
>>>>
>>>> Unless someone has gotten past this?
>>>>
>>>> Any additional clues, input, etc. on these statements?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Tom
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

"Tom" <> wrote in message
news:Oyd59o%...
> f-off thata is NOT my job nor should it be.
>
> I can clearly see the path to be able to do my job is deploy Linux and
> suggest my employer and the millions in Usent in high tech do the same.
>
>
> "Tom [Pepper] Willett" <> wrote in message
> news:OxnPoC%...
>> ROFL...
>>
>> You'd better start learning some of this stuff, troll.
>>
>>
>> "Tom" <> wrote in message
>> news:...
>>> it takes me to ud 6
>>>
>>> also, I havbe no clue what regmon or filemon are, nor should I need to.
>>>
>>>
>>> "Robert Aldwinckle" <> wrote in message
>>> news:...
>>>> "Tom" <> wrote in message
>>>> news:...
>>>>> So, while having to keep fishing for the answers, at least a direction
>>>>> has
>>>>> been revealed by some of the ms-mvp's here.
>>>>> I think they could have gotten here faster if they would detach
>>>>> themselves
>>>>> from the canned KB*** error #s.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> So, I have discovered that for all hives (except one), I have four
>>>>> user
>>>>> groups:
>>>>>
>>>>> Administrators (TOMS\Administrators)
>>>>> CREATOR OWNER
>>>>> SYSTEM
>>>>> Users (TOMS\Users)
>>>>>
>>>>> For all hives with these groups listed, except for HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT,
>>>>> all
>>>>> groups have full access.
>>>>> For this group, Users does not have Full Control and I'm apparently
>>>>> logged
>>>>> on as a User, so I cannot do anything with anything that changes those
>>>>> keys.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, this should mean one of two things:
>>>>> - I was always logged in before as an Administrator
>>>>> - Users had full control
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I noticed in one of your other posts that you are using the MU agent.
>>>>
>>>> When did you install MU? E.g. if that is when you switched from
>>>> using
>>>> WUv4 to WUv6 you could be seeing a problem with WUv6 or that agent.
>>>> FYI in both WUv5 and WUv6 the user's account is not the only criterion
>>>> for permissions. So the message you are getting then might be for the
>>>> other account(s) which are being used.
>>>>
>>>> This is the kind of detail which concurrent tracing by FileMon and
>>>> RegMon
>>>> could help clarify.
>>>>
>>>> BTW so far you have given us very few details to work with.
>>>> For example, I haven't seen in all your posts even which OS
>>>> and maintenance level your problem machine is using.
>>>> You seem to be posting from XPsp2 with no other maintenance.
>>>> In that case you were probably using WUv5 earlier so the point
>>>> about permissions for multiple accounts won't be a simple binary
>>>> factor but I still think it is one worth investigating.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> HTH
>>>>
>>>> Robert Aldwinckle
>>>> ---
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "and" a December 13th update changed this.
>>>>> I am not sure which.
>>>>>
>>>>> There is a catch (of course).
>>>>> While in the middle of my 50 hours on the phone with support, I logged
>>>>> in as
>>>>> an Administrator and still had the Access Denied issue with Windows
>>>>> Installer 3.1 after it was forced.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> So, while I thought I was onto something, I think it's another dead
>>>>> end.
>>>>>
>>>>> Unless someone has gotten past this?
>>>>>
>>>>> Any additional clues, input, etc. on these statements?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Tom
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>