Installing Quicken in Program Files

It appears that Intuit is telling Vista users not to install
Quicken in the Program Files folder.

Does anyone here have any experience that would support, or
contradict, this recommendation?

Any comments on the idea in general? Are there any good
reasons (or ANY reasons) why software should not be
installed in the Program Files folder? Are there short, or
long, term benefits, or costs, to doing this?

Seeker wrote:
> It appears that Intuit is telling Vista users not to install
> Quicken in the Program Files folder.
>
> Does anyone here have any experience that would support, or
> contradict, this recommendation?
>
> Any comments on the idea in general? Are there any good
> reasons (or ANY reasons) why software should not be
> installed in the Program Files folder? Are there short, or
> long, term benefits, or costs, to doing this?
>
>

A developer is going to set-up an install package to install the
software into a directory he or she chooses to create. It could be to a
directory that's standalone or it could be a sub-directory under Program
Files.

Under Vista with UAC enabled, a user, even an Admin user is prohibited
from doing certain things, and one needs to know how to come around
those restrictive situations with UAC enabled, most don't know how to do
it.

Situations where one may need to do maintenance to a data file that
resides at the location of the exe file in a sub-directory in the
Programs File directory, and Vista is blocking access to the user,
because of permission issues. And the user, and most users don't, know
how to get the permissions needed to allow it to happen.

So, yes I can see why a 3rd party software vendor would advise someone
to install software in a standalone directory where the user as admin on
the machine would have Full control of the directory and the files in
the directory.

The same applies on the System32 directory when UAC is enabled. It's a
different ball game for the Admin user on Vista with the Program Files
and System32 when UAC is enabled, as opposed to Win XP or Win 2k.

Paul Montgumdrop wrote:
> Seeker wrote:
>> It appears that Intuit is telling Vista users not to
>> install
>> Quicken in the Program Files folder.
>>
>> Does anyone here have any experience that would support,
>> or
>> contradict, this recommendation?
>>
>> Any comments on the idea in general? Are there any good
>> reasons (or ANY reasons) why software should not be
>> installed in the Program Files folder? Are there short,
>> or
>> long, term benefits, or costs, to doing this?
>>

> A developer is going to set-up an install package to
> install the
> software into a directory he or she chooses to create. It
> could be to
> a directory that's standalone or it could be a
> sub-directory under
> Program Files.
>
> Under Vista with UAC enabled, a user, even an Admin user
> is prohibited
> from doing certain things, and one needs to know how to
> come around
> those restrictive situations with UAC enabled, most don't
> know how to
> do it.
>
> Situations where one may need to do maintenance to a data
> file that
> resides at the location of the exe file in a sub-directory
> in the
> Programs File directory, and Vista is blocking access to
> the user,
> because of permission issues. And the user, and most users
> don't, know
> how to get the permissions needed to allow it to happen.
>
> So, yes I can see why a 3rd party software vendor would
> advise someone
> to install software in a standalone directory where the
> user as admin
> on the machine would have Full control of the directory
> and the files
> in the directory.
>
> The same applies on the System32 directory when UAC is
> enabled. It's a
> different ball game for the Admin user on Vista with the
> Program Files
> and System32 when UAC is enabled, as opposed to Win XP or
> Win 2k.

Thanks for the reply.

The install defaults to installing in the Program Files
directory; users contacting tech support are being told to
reinstall in a folder that's not in the Program Files
folder.

The default Quicken data fileset is stored in the Vista
replacement for Documents and Settings. And users are also
told to keep their data somewhere besides the Program Files
folder.

So am I correct in thinking you don't believe that any
security is being sacrificed by installing applications in a
non-Program Files folder created by the user?

Seeker wrote:
> It appears that Intuit is telling Vista users not to
> install
> Quicken in the Program Files folder.
>
> Does anyone here have any experience that would support,
> or
> contradict, this recommendation?
>
> Any comments on the idea in general? Are there any good
> reasons (or ANY reasons) why software should not be
> installed in the Program Files folder? Are there short,
> or
> long, term benefits, or costs, to doing this?

I'm especially hoping to hear from Quicken/Vista users who
have experience with the effects of installing Quicken into
the Program Files folder.

Seeker wrote:
> Paul Montgumdrop wrote:
>> Seeker wrote:
>>> It appears that Intuit is telling Vista users not to
>>> install
>>> Quicken in the Program Files folder.
>>>
>>> Does anyone here have any experience that would support,
>>> or
>>> contradict, this recommendation?
>>>
>>> Any comments on the idea in general? Are there any good
>>> reasons (or ANY reasons) why software should not be
>>> installed in the Program Files folder? Are there short,
>>> or
>>> long, term benefits, or costs, to doing this?
>>>
>
>> A developer is going to set-up an install package to
>> install the
>> software into a directory he or she chooses to create. It
>> could be to
>> a directory that's standalone or it could be a
>> sub-directory under
>> Program Files.
>>
>> Under Vista with UAC enabled, a user, even an Admin user
>> is prohibited
>> from doing certain things, and one needs to know how to
>> come around
>> those restrictive situations with UAC enabled, most don't
>> know how to
>> do it.
>>
>> Situations where one may need to do maintenance to a data
>> file that
>> resides at the location of the exe file in a sub-directory
>> in the
>> Programs File directory, and Vista is blocking access to
>> the user,
>> because of permission issues. And the user, and most users
>> don't, know
>> how to get the permissions needed to allow it to happen.
>>
>> So, yes I can see why a 3rd party software vendor would
>> advise someone
>> to install software in a standalone directory where the
>> user as admin
>> on the machine would have Full control of the directory
>> and the files
>> in the directory.
>>
>> The same applies on the System32 directory when UAC is
>> enabled. It's a
>> different ball game for the Admin user on Vista with the
>> Program Files
>> and System32 when UAC is enabled, as opposed to Win XP or
>> Win 2k.
>
> Thanks for the reply.
>
> The install defaults to installing in the Program Files
> directory; users contacting tech support are being told to
> reinstall in a folder that's not in the Program Files
> folder.
>
That's because the Program Folder has more restrictions applied to the
folder on Vista with UAC enabled and is protected better on Vista as
opposed to its predecessors.

The Program Files folder on the predecessors is/was wide open to attack,
even by someone who has compromised the machine with a malware program
running under the rights of a User/Admin with full rights, like on XP or
Win 2k.

User/Admin on Vista with UAC enabled is NOT a full rights user/admim
user account and is prohibited in some cases in doing things which would
include a malware program trying to run under the User/Admin rights of
the user, unless the user/admin knows how to come around those restrictions.

Someone in a tech support role at some 3rd party vendor no more knows
how to come around those restrictions than the user using Vista.

So, I suspect they are telling the user to create another folder and
install the application there where the folder doesn't have such
restrictive measures applied to it, like the Program Files folder where
even the user/admin is locked down to some extent with UAC.


> The default Quicken data fileset is stored in the Vista
> replacement for Documents and Settings. And users are also
> told to keep their data somewhere besides the Program Files
> folder.

User/Admin on Vista with UAC is NOT an account that has Full rights like
it has on Win XP or Win 2K in some cases is the bottom line and Program
Files is one of those cases, unless you know how to come around the
restrictions. Like I said, most users of Vista don't know how to come
around the restrictions as an user/admin.
>
> So am I correct in thinking you don't believe that any
> security is being sacrificed by installing applications in a
> non-Program Files folder created by the user?

Well, it seems that solutions are more attackable not being in the
Programs File folder with Vista UAC enabled, if one applies commonsense
to it.

But that also depends upon the 3rd party software solution's development
team in understanding how to protect its solution from a security
standpoint no matter what folder it resides in too.

jetjock wrote:
> On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 15:58:58 -0500, "Seeker"
> <>
> wrote:
>
>> Seeker wrote:
>>> It appears that Intuit is telling Vista users not to
>>> install
>>> Quicken in the Program Files folder.
>>>
>>> Does anyone here have any experience that would support,
>>> or
>>> contradict, this recommendation?
>>>
>>> Any comments on the idea in general? Are there any good
>>> reasons (or ANY reasons) why software should not be
>>> installed in the Program Files folder? Are there short,
>>> or
>>> long, term benefits, or costs, to doing this?
>>
>> I'm especially hoping to hear from Quicken/Vista users
>> who
>> have experience with the effects of installing Quicken
>> into
>> the Program Files folder.
>>

> The biggest drawback I have found to using a folder under
> Program
> Files is the inability to access anything in Program Files
> via a
> network. I have a small home network and if I install
> Quicken under
> Program Files, I can't access it from any of my networked
> computers.

Thanks for the feedback.

Is that limitation intended by MS? Could Intuit make it
possible to access the app over a network? [I know Intuit
doesn't recommend using Quicken over a network, but I've
always believed that pertained to accessing the data files
over a network, not the app itself.]

"Seeker" <> wrote in message
news:...
> jetjock wrote:
>> On Fri, 26 Sep 2008 15:58:58 -0500, "Seeker" <>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Seeker wrote:
>>>> It appears that Intuit is telling Vista users not to
>>>> install
>>>> Quicken in the Program Files folder.
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone here have any experience that would support,
>>>> or
>>>> contradict, this recommendation?
>>>>
>>>> Any comments on the idea in general? Are there any good
>>>> reasons (or ANY reasons) why software should not be
>>>> installed in the Program Files folder? Are there short,
>>>> or
>>>> long, term benefits, or costs, to doing this?
>>>
>>> I'm especially hoping to hear from Quicken/Vista users who
>>> have experience with the effects of installing Quicken into
>>> the Program Files folder.
>>>
>
>> The biggest drawback I have found to using a folder under Program
>> Files is the inability to access anything in Program Files via a
>> network. I have a small home network and if I install Quicken under
>> Program Files, I can't access it from any of my networked computers.
>
> Thanks for the feedback.
>
> Is that limitation intended by MS? Could Intuit make it possible to
> access the app over a network? [I know Intuit doesn't recommend using
> Quicken over a network, but I've always believed that pertained to
> accessing the data files over a network, not the app itself.]
>
Since XP, the Microsoft "standard" is that applications keep their data
elsewhere - usually Application Data for data the program uses for itself,
(My) Documents for data that the user needs to access. The intent is that
Program Files is not to be altered after installation for security reasons.

Intuit should be keeping the user's Account files in Application Data and
create reports in, say, "(My) Documents/Quicken Reports". Unfortunately,
it seems to not do so. I keep my accounts files in an Application Data
folder that I created. This means that it is easier to backup as it is part
of Documents & Settings.

Nigel