MSFT Drinking Same Cool Aid as West Wing

MSFT is staying the course despite all clinical signs on the ground just as
its native country is doing so with 3 billion spent a week and a total
fiasco beyond all imagined proportions. Both are trying to do an incredible
selling job of black as white.

http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39283752,00.htm

For one arena we have Woodward's book and the contorted posturing to deny
the trainwreck in the war to preserve oil addiction in the United States

http://www.amazon.com/State-Denial-B.../dp/0743272234

Redmond is conducting a parallel state of denial--and by the way the Upgrade
Advisor is patently wrong in many many hardware assessment situations--just
flat out wrong in saying drivers will not work and that hardware will not
run Vista superbly and exremely fast and faster on the same box than XP.

Maybe Condi Rice now caught in scores of lies and totally out of her depth
should work with Sinofsky and Brad Goldberg--they'd be comfortable in
selling delusions.

News > Software > Windows Tuesday 3rd October 2006





Microsoft predicts Vista stampede


Joris Evers
CNET News.com
October 02, 2006, 08:50 BST


Tell us your opinion

Software giant claims businesses will rush to upgrade to Vista,
but analysts paint a different picture





Microsoft is predicting that Windows Vista will be adopted by
companies twice as fast as its predecessor, Windows XP.


Twelve months after the release of Vista, Microsoft expects that
usage share of the oft-delayed operating system in businesses will be double
that of XP a year after it shipped, said Brad Goldberg, general manager for
Windows product management at the software maker.


"Vista is built for businesses," Goldberg said. "We're giving
businesses the tools they need to get out of the gate faster with Vista...
Our goal is to have twice as fast deployment of Vista than for any other
operating system."


Microsoft declined to give its own figures on Windows XP's usage
percentages, and instead referred to research by IDC. According to the
analyst company, XP was installed on about 10 percent of enterprise PCs
after a year. That would put the goal for Vista at 20 percent.


"For them to do 20 percent in the first 12 months of
availability is almost impossible," said Al Gillen, an analyst at IDC. "They
have done all the right things, but adoption is going to be driven by
corporate adoption and deployment cycles, more so than by whether Microsoft
has greased the skids to make the product glide in faster."


IDC expects a healthy adoption of Vista, Gillen said. "But we're
not expecting it to be fundamentally different from previous releases of
Windows," he said. IDC's projections suggest that 11 percent of business PCs
that run Windows will be running Vista at the end of next year, Gillen said.


Rival analyst company Gartner expects the installed base of
Vista in large enterprises to be about 10 percent a year and a half after it
ships. "We're not hearing companies say they're in a rush to get their users
to Vista," said Gartner analyst Michael Silver.


Vista, the first major upgrade to Windows since XP shipped in
late 2001, is slated to become available to businesses in November. Broad
availability is scheduled for January.


Help and hindrance
Microsoft has said that corporate adoption of Windows XP was
slower than it would have liked.


XP was slow to gain traction among enterprise customers, in part
because it came on the heels of Windows 2000, Goldberg said. Additionally,
Microsoft was late with tools to support its adoption. For example, a kit to
test the compatibility of applications with XP was released nine months
after the operating system, and documented deployment guidance took two
years, he said.


With Vista, those tools, as well as people trained to help
businesses move to the Windows update, will be available as soon as it ships
or shortly thereafter, Goldberg said.


Furthermore, Vista should make it easier and cheaper for
organisations to manage PCs that run the new operating system, Goldberg
said. "Vista has business customers at the centre of everything we've done,"
he said. "In some cases, it will be cheaper for an organisation to upgrade
to Vista than to keep their current configuration."


Microsoft has addressed many of the key adoption blockers, but
that alone isn't enough, Silver said. A lot will hinge on the availability
of third-party software that supports the update. "That's the biggest
inhibitor to deploying a lot of Vista very soon after it ships," he said.


One Microsoft customer plans to upgrade to Vista at a pace even
quicker than its maker predicts — but not for the sake of getting a new
operating system. Instead, the operating system will come in as part of its
upgrade cycle for computers.


"When we replace our PCs, they will run Vista, and we will
replace a third of our PCs over the next year," said Thomas Smith, the
manager of client services at a large Houston company.


Smith, who is responsible for about 9,000 PCs, doesn't buy
Microsoft's argument that Vista is cheaper to run.


"It takes more hardware, the learning curve is costly, the help
desk calls are going to escalate, we'll have to manage both XP and Vista, I
think you're actually going to increase cost, at least in the short term,"
he said.



Time will tell. Stay the course with the actual Beta 1 that is going to RTM
in 21 days. In case after case, MSFT Vista team members have been directly
emailed major bugs and they pretend ***not to see them.

They won't get fixed come Sp1 either. It must be wonderful to be able to
sustain such arrogance while Rome burns.

CH

"Chad Harris" <Vista RTM is really Beta 1.net> wrote in message
news:...
> MSFT is staying the course despite all clinical signs on the ground just
> as its native country is doing so with 3 billion spent a week and a total
> fiasco beyond all imagined proportions. Both are trying to do an
> incredible selling job of black as white.
>
> http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39283752,00.htm
>
> For one arena we have Woodward's book and the contorted posturing to deny
> the trainwreck in the war to preserve oil addiction in the United States
>
> http://www.amazon.com/State-Denial-B.../dp/0743272234
>
> Redmond is conducting a parallel state of denial--and by the way the
> Upgrade Advisor is patently wrong in many many hardware assessment
> situations--just flat out wrong in saying drivers will not work and that
> hardware will not run Vista superbly and exremely fast and faster on the
> same box than XP.
>
> Maybe Condi Rice now caught in scores of lies and totally out of her depth
> should work with Sinofsky and Brad Goldberg--they'd be comfortable in
> selling delusions.
>
> News > Software > Windows Tuesday 3rd October 2006
>
>
>
>
>
> Microsoft predicts Vista stampede
>
>
> Joris Evers
> CNET News.com
> October 02, 2006, 08:50 BST
>
>
> Tell us your opinion
>
> Software giant claims businesses will rush to upgrade to Vista,
> but analysts paint a different picture
>
>
>
>
>
> Microsoft is predicting that Windows Vista will be adopted by
> companies twice as fast as its predecessor, Windows XP.
>
>
> Twelve months after the release of Vista, Microsoft expects
> that usage share of the oft-delayed operating system in businesses will be
> double that of XP a year after it shipped, said Brad Goldberg, general
> manager for Windows product management at the software maker.
>
>
> "Vista is built for businesses," Goldberg said. "We're giving
> businesses the tools they need to get out of the gate faster with Vista...
> Our goal is to have twice as fast deployment of Vista than for any other
> operating system."
>
>
> Microsoft declined to give its own figures on Windows XP's
> usage percentages, and instead referred to research by IDC. According to
> the analyst company, XP was installed on about 10 percent of enterprise
> PCs after a year. That would put the goal for Vista at 20 percent.
>
>
> "For them to do 20 percent in the first 12 months of
> availability is almost impossible," said Al Gillen, an analyst at IDC.
> "They have done all the right things, but adoption is going to be driven
> by corporate adoption and deployment cycles, more so than by whether
> Microsoft has greased the skids to make the product glide in faster."
>
>
> IDC expects a healthy adoption of Vista, Gillen said. "But
> we're not expecting it to be fundamentally different from previous
> releases of Windows," he said. IDC's projections suggest that 11 percent
> of business PCs that run Windows will be running Vista at the end of next
> year, Gillen said.
>
>
> Rival analyst company Gartner expects the installed base of
> Vista in large enterprises to be about 10 percent a year and a half after
> it ships. "We're not hearing companies say they're in a rush to get their
> users to Vista," said Gartner analyst Michael Silver.
>
>
> Vista, the first major upgrade to Windows since XP shipped in
> late 2001, is slated to become available to businesses in November. Broad
> availability is scheduled for January.
>
>
> Help and hindrance
> Microsoft has said that corporate adoption of Windows XP was
> slower than it would have liked.
>
>
> XP was slow to gain traction among enterprise customers, in
> part because it came on the heels of Windows 2000, Goldberg said.
> Additionally, Microsoft was late with tools to support its adoption. For
> example, a kit to test the compatibility of applications with XP was
> released nine months after the operating system, and documented deployment
> guidance took two years, he said.
>
>
> With Vista, those tools, as well as people trained to help
> businesses move to the Windows update, will be available as soon as it
> ships or shortly thereafter, Goldberg said.
>
>
> Furthermore, Vista should make it easier and cheaper for
> organisations to manage PCs that run the new operating system, Goldberg
> said. "Vista has business customers at the centre of everything we've
> done," he said. "In some cases, it will be cheaper for an organisation to
> upgrade to Vista than to keep their current configuration."
>
>
> Microsoft has addressed many of the key adoption blockers, but
> that alone isn't enough, Silver said. A lot will hinge on the availability
> of third-party software that supports the update. "That's the biggest
> inhibitor to deploying a lot of Vista very soon after it ships," he said.
>
>
> One Microsoft customer plans to upgrade to Vista at a pace even
> quicker than its maker predicts - but not for the sake of getting a new
> operating system. Instead, the operating system will come in as part of
> its upgrade cycle for computers.
>
>
> "When we replace our PCs, they will run Vista, and we will
> replace a third of our PCs over the next year," said Thomas Smith, the
> manager of client services at a large Houston company.
>
>
> Smith, who is responsible for about 9,000 PCs, doesn't buy
> Microsoft's argument that Vista is cheaper to run.
>
>
> "It takes more hardware, the learning curve is costly, the help
> desk calls are going to escalate, we'll have to manage both XP and Vista,
> I think you're actually going to increase cost, at least in the short
> term," he said.
>
>
>
> Time will tell. Stay the course with the actual Beta 1 that is going to
> RTM in 21 days. In case after case, MSFT Vista team members have been
> directly emailed major bugs and they pretend ***not to see them.
>
> They won't get fixed come Sp1 either. It must be wonderful to be able to
> sustain such arrogance while Rome burns.
>
> CH

What a load of crap.

--

Rock [ MVP User/Shell]

I agree with you on this Rock and it seems to be that Microsoft is
trying hard to do what is right in the case of Vista. I have been
continually reporting issues with Vista to Microsoft and have been on
the telephone several times with talks about Vista.

"Chad Harris" wrote:

<snip>

> In case after case, MSFT Vista team members have been directly
> emailed major bugs and they pretend ***not to see them.

I hope so! I prefer that they spend their time fixing bugs that were
submitted via the authorized process instead of being distracted with direct
e-mail.

For those that choose to give Paul Thurrott credibility, he reports that
Vista had 2479 bugs on 9/22, over 1400 bugs at this time, and will have 500
or fewer before RTM (see link below). If true, the developers *are* hard at
work and on track.

http://www.windowsitpro.com/windowsp...ott_93715.html

They have received a number of problems with a quintissential tin ear
pretending they didn't hear about them as a matter of fact with about 19
days to go to RTM and a hastily thrown out RC2 in 3.

They continue to block access to their "public customers" and so-called
CPPers to any meaningful bug information on Connect--that's how concerned
with feedback they are.

And Dan you have had conversations on precisely what that you have ID'd and
the fixes have been precisely what. The devil is in the details.

Reading your syncophantic accolade gives no clue as to what you got fixed,
modded or innovated at Redmond as to 22 or so days and counting RTM Vista.

I hear "doing the right thing" a lot with the stay the course lemmings as to
Iraq with disastrous results.

CH


"Dan W." <> wrote in message
news:...
>I agree with you on this Rock and it seems to be that Microsoft is trying
>hard to do what is right in the case of Vista. I have been continually
>reporting issues with Vista to Microsoft and have been on the telephone
>several times with talks about Vista.

Articulate as it was elegant Rock. But I have lots of MVP company mah man
and lots of analysis to support me--and I linked many of them previously.
Not just as to unrealistic sales projections of the slide I'm looking
at--but feature by feature. It's not my job to sell Vista. I'm more
interested in what's shipping.

Needs 6 more months at least just to CPR the broken features left not to
mention the ones on the cutting room floor--ain't gonna get it.

Yo Rock crank up that Device Manager and tell me why I can trash several of
your drivers and it will still say they are A-okay? Cause Dev Manager
birthed with the Windows '95 Launch on August 25, 1995. So would it have
been rushing any Windoz teams to fix Device Manager by 10/3/06? Jist
wondrin?

And the fact that Office 2007 on Vista and on XP sometimes has to
re-mini-install --that's going to impress a lot of enterpise and small
businesses fer sure?

Or perhaps you meant how splendidly organized the Iraq affair is with
Bremmer now all over TV saying that he was stupid for doing what he did but
Rummy and Condi made him?

Or the now serial clips of Condi on a split screen calling her self a she
said she said liar?

It's only 3000 dead Iraquis per month and 3 billion dollars a week and how
about that graph of deaths by the insurgency growing exponentially from
2002-2006 or is that graft by Kellogg-Brown-Root?

Oil Graft Fuels the Insurgency, Iraq and U.S. Say
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/05/in...f96fa6&ei=5088

State of Denial: Bush at War, Part III (Hardcover)
http://www.amazon.com/State-Denial-B.../dp/0743272234

CH

A big shoutout for Senators Patty Murray and Maria Cantwell who have no skin
in the game who are dynamically and insightfully pushing "stay the course"
with other peoples' children--you non-sistahs is doin' Seattle proud.


"Rock" <> wrote in message
news:...
> "Chad Harris" <Vista RTM is really Beta 1.net> wrote in message
> news:...
>> MSFT is staying the course despite all clinical signs on the ground just
>> as its native country is doing so with 3 billion spent a week and a total
>> fiasco beyond all imagined proportions. Both are trying to do an
>> incredible selling job of black as white.
>>
>> http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39283752,00.htm
>>
>> For one arena we have Woodward's book and the contorted posturing to deny
>> the trainwreck in the war to preserve oil addiction in the United States
>>
>> http://www.amazon.com/State-Denial-B.../dp/0743272234
>>
>> Redmond is conducting a parallel state of denial--and by the way the
>> Upgrade Advisor is patently wrong in many many hardware assessment
>> situations--just flat out wrong in saying drivers will not work and that
>> hardware will not run Vista superbly and exremely fast and faster on the
>> same box than XP.
>>
>> Maybe Condi Rice now caught in scores of lies and totally out of her
>> depth should work with Sinofsky and Brad Goldberg--they'd be comfortable
>> in selling delusions.
>>
>> News > Software > Windows Tuesday 3rd October 2006
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Microsoft predicts Vista stampede
>>
>>
>> Joris Evers
>> CNET News.com
>> October 02, 2006, 08:50 BST
>>
>>
>> Tell us your opinion
>>
>> Software giant claims businesses will rush to upgrade to
>> Vista, but analysts paint a different picture
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Microsoft is predicting that Windows Vista will be adopted by
>> companies twice as fast as its predecessor, Windows XP.
>>
>>
>> Twelve months after the release of Vista, Microsoft expects
>> that usage share of the oft-delayed operating system in businesses will
>> be double that of XP a year after it shipped, said Brad Goldberg, general
>> manager for Windows product management at the software maker.
>>
>>
>> "Vista is built for businesses," Goldberg said. "We're giving
>> businesses the tools they need to get out of the gate faster with
>> Vista... Our goal is to have twice as fast deployment of Vista than for
>> any other operating system."
>>
>>
>> Microsoft declined to give its own figures on Windows XP's
>> usage percentages, and instead referred to research by IDC. According to
>> the analyst company, XP was installed on about 10 percent of enterprise
>> PCs after a year. That would put the goal for Vista at 20 percent.
>>
>>
>> "For them to do 20 percent in the first 12 months of
>> availability is almost impossible," said Al Gillen, an analyst at IDC.
>> "They have done all the right things, but adoption is going to be driven
>> by corporate adoption and deployment cycles, more so than by whether
>> Microsoft has greased the skids to make the product glide in faster."
>>
>>
>> IDC expects a healthy adoption of Vista, Gillen said. "But
>> we're not expecting it to be fundamentally different from previous
>> releases of Windows," he said. IDC's projections suggest that 11 percent
>> of business PCs that run Windows will be running Vista at the end of next
>> year, Gillen said.
>>
>>
>> Rival analyst company Gartner expects the installed base of
>> Vista in large enterprises to be about 10 percent a year and a half after
>> it ships. "We're not hearing companies say they're in a rush to get their
>> users to Vista," said Gartner analyst Michael Silver.
>>
>>
>> Vista, the first major upgrade to Windows since XP shipped in
>> late 2001, is slated to become available to businesses in November. Broad
>> availability is scheduled for January.
>>
>>
>> Help and hindrance
>> Microsoft has said that corporate adoption of Windows XP was
>> slower than it would have liked.
>>
>>
>> XP was slow to gain traction among enterprise customers, in
>> part because it came on the heels of Windows 2000, Goldberg said.
>> Additionally, Microsoft was late with tools to support its adoption. For
>> example, a kit to test the compatibility of applications with XP was
>> released nine months after the operating system, and documented
>> deployment guidance took two years, he said.
>>
>>
>> With Vista, those tools, as well as people trained to help
>> businesses move to the Windows update, will be available as soon as it
>> ships or shortly thereafter, Goldberg said.
>>
>>
>> Furthermore, Vista should make it easier and cheaper for
>> organisations to manage PCs that run the new operating system, Goldberg
>> said. "Vista has business customers at the centre of everything we've
>> done," he said. "In some cases, it will be cheaper for an organisation to
>> upgrade to Vista than to keep their current configuration."
>>
>>
>> Microsoft has addressed many of the key adoption blockers, but
>> that alone isn't enough, Silver said. A lot will hinge on the
>> availability of third-party software that supports the update. "That's
>> the biggest inhibitor to deploying a lot of Vista very soon after it
>> ships," he said.
>>
>>
>> One Microsoft customer plans to upgrade to Vista at a pace
>> even quicker than its maker predicts - but not for the sake of getting a
>> new operating system. Instead, the operating system will come in as part
>> of its upgrade cycle for computers.
>>
>>
>> "When we replace our PCs, they will run Vista, and we will
>> replace a third of our PCs over the next year," said Thomas Smith, the
>> manager of client services at a large Houston company.
>>
>>
>> Smith, who is responsible for about 9,000 PCs, doesn't buy
>> Microsoft's argument that Vista is cheaper to run.
>>
>>
>> "It takes more hardware, the learning curve is costly, the
>> help desk calls are going to escalate, we'll have to manage both XP and
>> Vista, I think you're actually going to increase cost, at least in the
>> short term," he said.
>>
>>
>>
>> Time will tell. Stay the course with the actual Beta 1 that is going to
>> RTM in 21 days. In case after case, MSFT Vista team members have been
>> directly emailed major bugs and they pretend ***not to see them.
>>
>> They won't get fixed come Sp1 either. It must be wonderful to be able to
>> sustain such arrogance while Rome burns.
>>
>> CH
>
> What a load of crap.
>
> --
>
> Rock [ MVP User/Shell]

PNutts lol--

Pretty nebulous.

The exact same refers to authorized bug processes. I know all of them as
well if not better than you do TBT or non-TBT--and I'm willing to bet I've
been a part of as many.

And they were so interested in their public program that they hid the chats,
the Live Meetings, bug access on Connnect--and I can show you scores of TBT
messages where they are frustrated and ticked off that their bug reports
were ignored or closed with no resolution as by design when things are
shipping broken.

Let me know how fast you see Device Manager fixed--cause it ain't gonna
happen this side of Blackcomb/Vienna if then according to the device and
driver related teams.

Device Manager is that little utility that purports to tell you a driver is
working but doesn't. Check it out some day--devmgmt.msc in your run
box>enter.

Check the chat on that several months ago since you're so familiar with the
process.

No one said developers including scores of outsiders debugging Vista aren't
hard at work--but a lot of serious Windows authors say they aren't on track
and what's shipping is horrendous compared to what it could have been and
ought to be.

CH

"PNutts" <> wrote in message
news:C98D8013-A0A1-43BA-B6A8-...
> "Chad Harris" wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>> In case after case, MSFT Vista team members have been directly
>> emailed major bugs and they pretend ***not to see them.
>
> I hope so! I prefer that they spend their time fixing bugs that were
> submitted via the authorized process instead of being distracted with
> direct
> e-mail.
>
> For those that choose to give Paul Thurrott credibility, he reports that
> Vista had 2479 bugs on 9/22, over 1400 bugs at this time, and will have
> 500
> or fewer before RTM (see link below). If true, the developers *are* hard
> at
> work and on track.
>
> http://www.windowsitpro.com/windowsp...ott_93715.html

If you have something relevant to say, keep it reasonably on topic.
If you can not stay on topic, your true motive is apparent..

There is no reason to bring politics to this newsgroup.
The comparison is a feeble attempt to interject your politics into this non
political newsgroup.

The drivers you refer, are they designed specifically for Windows XP?
If not, that is the reason, use at your own risk and the user can blame no
one but himself if there are issues.

Your intermittent use of quotes makes it difficult to know what you wrote
and what are quotes from others.
Can we ASSUME anything not in quotes is your own rants?
That would be the general understanding if you wrote correctly.

Get rid of the irrelevant politics and post back or continue on your path to
be marked a troll with off topic posts.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org


"Chad Harris" <Vista RTM is really Beta 1.net> wrote in message
news:...
> MSFT is staying the course despite all clinical signs on the ground just
> as its native country is doing so with 3 billion spent a week and a total
> fiasco beyond all imagined proportions. Both are trying to do an
> incredible selling job of black as white.
>
> http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39283752,00.htm
>
> For one arena we have Woodward's book and the contorted posturing to deny
> the trainwreck in the war to preserve oil addiction in the United States
>
> http://www.amazon.com/State-Denial-B.../dp/0743272234
>
> Redmond is conducting a parallel state of denial--and by the way the
> Upgrade Advisor is patently wrong in many many hardware assessment
> situations--just flat out wrong in saying drivers will not work and that
> hardware will not run Vista superbly and exremely fast and faster on the
> same box than XP.
>
> Maybe Condi Rice now caught in scores of lies and totally out of her depth
> should work with Sinofsky and Brad Goldberg--they'd be comfortable in
> selling delusions.
>
> News > Software > Windows Tuesday 3rd October 2006
>
>
>
>
>
> Microsoft predicts Vista stampede
>
>
> Joris Evers
> CNET News.com
> October 02, 2006, 08:50 BST
>
>
> Tell us your opinion
>
> Software giant claims businesses will rush to upgrade to Vista,
> but analysts paint a different picture
>
>
>
>
>
> Microsoft is predicting that Windows Vista will be adopted by
> companies twice as fast as its predecessor, Windows XP.
>
>
> Twelve months after the release of Vista, Microsoft expects
> that usage share of the oft-delayed operating system in businesses will be
> double that of XP a year after it shipped, said Brad Goldberg, general
> manager for Windows product management at the software maker.
>
>
> "Vista is built for businesses," Goldberg said. "We're giving
> businesses the tools they need to get out of the gate faster with Vista...
> Our goal is to have twice as fast deployment of Vista than for any other
> operating system."
>
>
> Microsoft declined to give its own figures on Windows XP's
> usage percentages, and instead referred to research by IDC. According to
> the analyst company, XP was installed on about 10 percent of enterprise
> PCs after a year. That would put the goal for Vista at 20 percent.
>
>
> "For them to do 20 percent in the first 12 months of
> availability is almost impossible," said Al Gillen, an analyst at IDC.
> "They have done all the right things, but adoption is going to be driven
> by corporate adoption and deployment cycles, more so than by whether
> Microsoft has greased the skids to make the product glide in faster."
>
>
> IDC expects a healthy adoption of Vista, Gillen said. "But
> we're not expecting it to be fundamentally different from previous
> releases of Windows," he said. IDC's projections suggest that 11 percent
> of business PCs that run Windows will be running Vista at the end of next
> year, Gillen said.
>
>
> Rival analyst company Gartner expects the installed base of
> Vista in large enterprises to be about 10 percent a year and a half after
> it ships. "We're not hearing companies say they're in a rush to get their
> users to Vista," said Gartner analyst Michael Silver.
>
>
> Vista, the first major upgrade to Windows since XP shipped in
> late 2001, is slated to become available to businesses in November. Broad
> availability is scheduled for January.
>
>
> Help and hindrance
> Microsoft has said that corporate adoption of Windows XP was
> slower than it would have liked.
>
>
> XP was slow to gain traction among enterprise customers, in
> part because it came on the heels of Windows 2000, Goldberg said.
> Additionally, Microsoft was late with tools to support its adoption. For
> example, a kit to test the compatibility of applications with XP was
> released nine months after the operating system, and documented deployment
> guidance took two years, he said.
>
>
> With Vista, those tools, as well as people trained to help
> businesses move to the Windows update, will be available as soon as it
> ships or shortly thereafter, Goldberg said.
>
>
> Furthermore, Vista should make it easier and cheaper for
> organisations to manage PCs that run the new operating system, Goldberg
> said. "Vista has business customers at the centre of everything we've
> done," he said. "In some cases, it will be cheaper for an organisation to
> upgrade to Vista than to keep their current configuration."
>
>
> Microsoft has addressed many of the key adoption blockers, but
> that alone isn't enough, Silver said. A lot will hinge on the availability
> of third-party software that supports the update. "That's the biggest
> inhibitor to deploying a lot of Vista very soon after it ships," he said.
>
>
> One Microsoft customer plans to upgrade to Vista at a pace even
> quicker than its maker predicts - but not for the sake of getting a new
> operating system. Instead, the operating system will come in as part of
> its upgrade cycle for computers.
>
>
> "When we replace our PCs, they will run Vista, and we will
> replace a third of our PCs over the next year," said Thomas Smith, the
> manager of client services at a large Houston company.
>
>
> Smith, who is responsible for about 9,000 PCs, doesn't buy
> Microsoft's argument that Vista is cheaper to run.
>
>
> "It takes more hardware, the learning curve is costly, the help
> desk calls are going to escalate, we'll have to manage both XP and Vista,
> I think you're actually going to increase cost, at least in the short
> term," he said.
>
>
>
> Time will tell. Stay the course with the actual Beta 1 that is going to
> RTM in 21 days. In case after case, MSFT Vista team members have been
> directly emailed major bugs and they pretend ***not to see them.
>
> They won't get fixed come Sp1 either. It must be wonderful to be able to
> sustain such arrogance while Rome burns.
>
> CH

Tell it to somebody who cares.


"Chad Harris" <Vista RTM is really Beta 1.net> wrote in message
news:...
> MSFT is staying the course despite all clinical signs on the ground just
> as its native country is doing so with 3 billion spent a week and a total
> fiasco beyond all imagined proportions. Both are trying to do an
> incredible selling job of black as white.
>
> http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39283752,00.htm
>
> For one arena we have Woodward's book and the contorted posturing to deny
> the trainwreck in the war to preserve oil addiction in the United States
>
> http://www.amazon.com/State-Denial-B.../dp/0743272234
>
> Redmond is conducting a parallel state of denial--and by the way the
> Upgrade Advisor is patently wrong in many many hardware assessment
> situations--just flat out wrong in saying drivers will not work and that
> hardware will not run Vista superbly and exremely fast and faster on the
> same box than XP.
>
> Maybe Condi Rice now caught in scores of lies and totally out of her depth
> should work with Sinofsky and Brad Goldberg--they'd be comfortable in
> selling delusions.
>
> News > Software > Windows Tuesday 3rd October 2006
>
>
>
>
>
> Microsoft predicts Vista stampede
>
>
> Joris Evers
> CNET News.com
> October 02, 2006, 08:50 BST
>
>
> Tell us your opinion
>
> Software giant claims businesses will rush to upgrade to Vista,
> but analysts paint a different picture
>
>
>
>
>
> Microsoft is predicting that Windows Vista will be adopted by
> companies twice as fast as its predecessor, Windows XP.
>
>
> Twelve months after the release of Vista, Microsoft expects
> that usage share of the oft-delayed operating system in businesses will be
> double that of XP a year after it shipped, said Brad Goldberg, general
> manager for Windows product management at the software maker.
>
>
> "Vista is built for businesses," Goldberg said. "We're giving
> businesses the tools they need to get out of the gate faster with Vista...
> Our goal is to have twice as fast deployment of Vista than for any other
> operating system."
>
>
> Microsoft declined to give its own figures on Windows XP's
> usage percentages, and instead referred to research by IDC. According to
> the analyst company, XP was installed on about 10 percent of enterprise
> PCs after a year. That would put the goal for Vista at 20 percent.
>
>
> "For them to do 20 percent in the first 12 months of
> availability is almost impossible," said Al Gillen, an analyst at IDC.
> "They have done all the right things, but adoption is going to be driven
> by corporate adoption and deployment cycles, more so than by whether
> Microsoft has greased the skids to make the product glide in faster."
>
>
> IDC expects a healthy adoption of Vista, Gillen said. "But
> we're not expecting it to be fundamentally different from previous
> releases of Windows," he said. IDC's projections suggest that 11 percent
> of business PCs that run Windows will be running Vista at the end of next
> year, Gillen said.
>
>
> Rival analyst company Gartner expects the installed base of
> Vista in large enterprises to be about 10 percent a year and a half after
> it ships. "We're not hearing companies say they're in a rush to get their
> users to Vista," said Gartner analyst Michael Silver.
>
>
> Vista, the first major upgrade to Windows since XP shipped in
> late 2001, is slated to become available to businesses in November. Broad
> availability is scheduled for January.
>
>
> Help and hindrance
> Microsoft has said that corporate adoption of Windows XP was
> slower than it would have liked.
>
>
> XP was slow to gain traction among enterprise customers, in
> part because it came on the heels of Windows 2000, Goldberg said.
> Additionally, Microsoft was late with tools to support its adoption. For
> example, a kit to test the compatibility of applications with XP was
> released nine months after the operating system, and documented deployment
> guidance took two years, he said.
>
>
> With Vista, those tools, as well as people trained to help
> businesses move to the Windows update, will be available as soon as it
> ships or shortly thereafter, Goldberg said.
>
>
> Furthermore, Vista should make it easier and cheaper for
> organisations to manage PCs that run the new operating system, Goldberg
> said. "Vista has business customers at the centre of everything we've
> done," he said. "In some cases, it will be cheaper for an organisation to
> upgrade to Vista than to keep their current configuration."
>
>
> Microsoft has addressed many of the key adoption blockers, but
> that alone isn't enough, Silver said. A lot will hinge on the availability
> of third-party software that supports the update. "That's the biggest
> inhibitor to deploying a lot of Vista very soon after it ships," he said.
>
>
> One Microsoft customer plans to upgrade to Vista at a pace even
> quicker than its maker predicts - but not for the sake of getting a new
> operating system. Instead, the operating system will come in as part of
> its upgrade cycle for computers.
>
>
> "When we replace our PCs, they will run Vista, and we will
> replace a third of our PCs over the next year," said Thomas Smith, the
> manager of client services at a large Houston company.
>
>
> Smith, who is responsible for about 9,000 PCs, doesn't buy
> Microsoft's argument that Vista is cheaper to run.
>
>
> "It takes more hardware, the learning curve is costly, the help
> desk calls are going to escalate, we'll have to manage both XP and Vista,
> I think you're actually going to increase cost, at least in the short
> term," he said.
>
>
>
> Time will tell. Stay the course with the actual Beta 1 that is going to
> RTM in 21 days. In case after case, MSFT Vista team members have been
> directly emailed major bugs and they pretend ***not to see them.
>
> They won't get fixed come Sp1 either. It must be wonderful to be able to
> sustain such arrogance while Rome burns.
>
> CH
>
>
>
>

Agreed. There are plenty of political groups and blogs to rant about
whichever side of the fence you prefer. This ain't one of them.

"Jupiter Jones [MVP]" <> wrote in message
news:...
> If you have something relevant to say, keep it reasonably on topic.
> If you can not stay on topic, your true motive is apparent..
>
> There is no reason to bring politics to this newsgroup.
> The comparison is a feeble attempt to interject your politics into this
> non political newsgroup.
>
> The drivers you refer, are they designed specifically for Windows XP?
> If not, that is the reason, use at your own risk and the user can blame no
> one but himself if there are issues.
>
> Your intermittent use of quotes makes it difficult to know what you wrote
> and what are quotes from others.
> Can we ASSUME anything not in quotes is your own rants?
> That would be the general understanding if you wrote correctly.
>
> Get rid of the irrelevant politics and post back or continue on your path
> to be marked a troll with off topic posts.
>
> --
> Jupiter Jones [MVP]
> http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
> http://www.dts-l.org
>
>
> "Chad Harris" <Vista RTM is really Beta 1.net> wrote in message
> news:...
>> MSFT is staying the course despite all clinical signs on the ground just
>> as its native country is doing so with 3 billion spent a week and a total
>> fiasco beyond all imagined proportions. Both are trying to do an
>> incredible selling job of black as white.
>>
>> http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39283752,00.htm
>>
>> For one arena we have Woodward's book and the contorted posturing to deny
>> the trainwreck in the war to preserve oil addiction in the United States
>>
>> http://www.amazon.com/State-Denial-B.../dp/0743272234
>>
>> Redmond is conducting a parallel state of denial--and by the way the
>> Upgrade Advisor is patently wrong in many many hardware assessment
>> situations--just flat out wrong in saying drivers will not work and that
>> hardware will not run Vista superbly and exremely fast and faster on the
>> same box than XP.
>>
>> Maybe Condi Rice now caught in scores of lies and totally out of her
>> depth should work with Sinofsky and Brad Goldberg--they'd be comfortable
>> in selling delusions.
>>
>> News > Software > Windows Tuesday 3rd October 2006
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Microsoft predicts Vista stampede
>>
>>
>> Joris Evers
>> CNET News.com
>> October 02, 2006, 08:50 BST
>>
>>
>> Tell us your opinion
>>
>> Software giant claims businesses will rush to upgrade to
>> Vista, but analysts paint a different picture
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Microsoft is predicting that Windows Vista will be adopted by
>> companies twice as fast as its predecessor, Windows XP.
>>
>>
>> Twelve months after the release of Vista, Microsoft expects
>> that usage share of the oft-delayed operating system in businesses will
>> be double that of XP a year after it shipped, said Brad Goldberg, general
>> manager for Windows product management at the software maker.
>>
>>
>> "Vista is built for businesses," Goldberg said. "We're giving
>> businesses the tools they need to get out of the gate faster with
>> Vista... Our goal is to have twice as fast deployment of Vista than for
>> any other operating system."
>>
>>
>> Microsoft declined to give its own figures on Windows XP's
>> usage percentages, and instead referred to research by IDC. According to
>> the analyst company, XP was installed on about 10 percent of enterprise
>> PCs after a year. That would put the goal for Vista at 20 percent.
>>
>>
>> "For them to do 20 percent in the first 12 months of
>> availability is almost impossible," said Al Gillen, an analyst at IDC.
>> "They have done all the right things, but adoption is going to be driven
>> by corporate adoption and deployment cycles, more so than by whether
>> Microsoft has greased the skids to make the product glide in faster."
>>
>>
>> IDC expects a healthy adoption of Vista, Gillen said. "But
>> we're not expecting it to be fundamentally different from previous
>> releases of Windows," he said. IDC's projections suggest that 11 percent
>> of business PCs that run Windows will be running Vista at the end of next
>> year, Gillen said.
>>
>>
>> Rival analyst company Gartner expects the installed base of
>> Vista in large enterprises to be about 10 percent a year and a half after
>> it ships. "We're not hearing companies say they're in a rush to get their
>> users to Vista," said Gartner analyst Michael Silver.
>>
>>
>> Vista, the first major upgrade to Windows since XP shipped in
>> late 2001, is slated to become available to businesses in November. Broad
>> availability is scheduled for January.
>>
>>
>> Help and hindrance
>> Microsoft has said that corporate adoption of Windows XP was
>> slower than it would have liked.
>>
>>
>> XP was slow to gain traction among enterprise customers, in
>> part because it came on the heels of Windows 2000, Goldberg said.
>> Additionally, Microsoft was late with tools to support its adoption. For
>> example, a kit to test the compatibility of applications with XP was
>> released nine months after the operating system, and documented
>> deployment guidance took two years, he said.
>>
>>
>> With Vista, those tools, as well as people trained to help
>> businesses move to the Windows update, will be available as soon as it
>> ships or shortly thereafter, Goldberg said.
>>
>>
>> Furthermore, Vista should make it easier and cheaper for
>> organisations to manage PCs that run the new operating system, Goldberg
>> said. "Vista has business customers at the centre of everything we've
>> done," he said. "In some cases, it will be cheaper for an organisation to
>> upgrade to Vista than to keep their current configuration."
>>
>>
>> Microsoft has addressed many of the key adoption blockers, but
>> that alone isn't enough, Silver said. A lot will hinge on the
>> availability of third-party software that supports the update. "That's
>> the biggest inhibitor to deploying a lot of Vista very soon after it
>> ships," he said.
>>
>>
>> One Microsoft customer plans to upgrade to Vista at a pace
>> even quicker than its maker predicts - but not for the sake of getting a
>> new operating system. Instead, the operating system will come in as part
>> of its upgrade cycle for computers.
>>
>>
>> "When we replace our PCs, they will run Vista, and we will
>> replace a third of our PCs over the next year," said Thomas Smith, the
>> manager of client services at a large Houston company.
>>
>>
>> Smith, who is responsible for about 9,000 PCs, doesn't buy
>> Microsoft's argument that Vista is cheaper to run.
>>
>>
>> "It takes more hardware, the learning curve is costly, the
>> help desk calls are going to escalate, we'll have to manage both XP and
>> Vista, I think you're actually going to increase cost, at least in the
>> short term," he said.
>>
>>
>>
>> Time will tell. Stay the course with the actual Beta 1 that is going to
>> RTM in 21 days. In case after case, MSFT Vista team members have been
>> directly emailed major bugs and they pretend ***not to see them.
>>
>> They won't get fixed come Sp1 either. It must be wonderful to be able to
>> sustain such arrogance while Rome burns.
>>
>> CH
>
>
>