HELP! Vista BUG: My Documents on 2nd HD - No Permissions

Discussion in 'Windows Vista Installation' started by echostorm, Feb 22, 2007.

  1. echostorm

    echostorm Guest

    HELP! This is driving me crazy. I have a My Documents folder on a 2nd
    harddrive (F:\) that may have been part of the upgrade path from Windows XP
    Pro to Windows Vista Business (I rerouted the My Documents link in my
    previous Windows XP Pro installation to point there). The problem I have now
    is that all the permissions are set so that I cannot access files that were
    not explicitly created from my computer - ie, any files from like 10 years
    ago created somewhere long time ago seem to have no ability with UAC on to be
    accessed. I have changed ownership on the entire My Documents folder and sub
    folders and files, as well as enabled Full Control permissions to all the
    files, but somehow Windows Vista doesn't recognize any of this and will not
    allow me to access the older files still. The only fix for this is to turn
    the entire UAC control off, but even so I can't modify the My Documents
    Folder to any effect or renaming, moving, etc. It regardless always appears
    as "read only" as well even though I persistantly uncheck it and save... any
    suggestions!?
     
    echostorm, Feb 22, 2007
    #1
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  2. echostorm

    koze Guest

    Try a right click on the "Documents" from the start menu, you will see which
    folder the documents are in now and by using location tab from the
    properties you can change the location.

    Ko.
    "echostorm" <> schreef in bericht
    news:...
    > HELP! This is driving me crazy. I have a My Documents folder on a 2nd
    > harddrive (F:\) that may have been part of the upgrade path from Windows
    > XP
    > Pro to Windows Vista Business (I rerouted the My Documents link in my
    > previous Windows XP Pro installation to point there). The problem I have
    > now
    > is that all the permissions are set so that I cannot access files that
    > were
    > not explicitly created from my computer - ie, any files from like 10 years
    > ago created somewhere long time ago seem to have no ability with UAC on to
    > be
    > accessed. I have changed ownership on the entire My Documents folder and
    > sub
    > folders and files, as well as enabled Full Control permissions to all the
    > files, but somehow Windows Vista doesn't recognize any of this and will
    > not
    > allow me to access the older files still. The only fix for this is to turn
    > the entire UAC control off, but even so I can't modify the My Documents
    > Folder to any effect or renaming, moving, etc. It regardless always
    > appears
    > as "read only" as well even though I persistantly uncheck it and save...
    > any
    > suggestions!?
     
    koze, Feb 22, 2007
    #2
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  3. echostorm

    echostorm Guest

    Unfortunately that is not my problem, Vista has already established a new
    path to "Documents" with some stuff being put in there from subsequent
    program installs. It's basically the My Documents folder(s) from previous
    computers that I just copied onto a secondary hard drive. I would rename My
    Documents to "Our Documents" or something had I have known Vista would treat
    "My Documents" differently. Unlike the knowledge base suggestions, my
    absolute path for the My Documents folder in trouble is F:\My Documents which
    was self created... Vista apparently has locked this folder from access with
    UAC, from modification without UAC.

    "echostorm" wrote:

    > HELP! This is driving me crazy. I have a My Documents folder on a 2nd
    > harddrive (F:\) that may have been part of the upgrade path from Windows XP
    > Pro to Windows Vista Business (I rerouted the My Documents link in my
    > previous Windows XP Pro installation to point there). The problem I have now
    > is that all the permissions are set so that I cannot access files that were
    > not explicitly created from my computer - ie, any files from like 10 years
    > ago created somewhere long time ago seem to have no ability with UAC on to be
    > accessed. I have changed ownership on the entire My Documents folder and sub
    > folders and files, as well as enabled Full Control permissions to all the
    > files, but somehow Windows Vista doesn't recognize any of this and will not
    > allow me to access the older files still. The only fix for this is to turn
    > the entire UAC control off, but even so I can't modify the My Documents
    > Folder to any effect or renaming, moving, etc. It regardless always appears
    > as "read only" as well even though I persistantly uncheck it and save... any
    > suggestions!?
     
    echostorm, Feb 22, 2007
    #3
  4. echostorm

    koze Guest

    Then you have to take the ownership of that folder, including the ACL's and
    that has to be done as the real administrator.
    Not the build in admin. Add yourself to the owner of the folder include all
    the security settings needed.
    That can be done with the UAC normal on.

    Ko.

    "echostorm" <> schreef in bericht
    news:...
    > Unfortunately that is not my problem, Vista has already established a new
    > path to "Documents" with some stuff being put in there from subsequent
    > program installs. It's basically the My Documents folder(s) from previous
    > computers that I just copied onto a secondary hard drive. I would rename
    > My
    > Documents to "Our Documents" or something had I have known Vista would
    > treat
    > "My Documents" differently. Unlike the knowledge base suggestions, my
    > absolute path for the My Documents folder in trouble is F:\My Documents
    > which
    > was self created... Vista apparently has locked this folder from access
    > with
    > UAC, from modification without UAC.
    >
    > "echostorm" wrote:
    >
    >> HELP! This is driving me crazy. I have a My Documents folder on a 2nd
    >> harddrive (F:\) that may have been part of the upgrade path from Windows
    >> XP
    >> Pro to Windows Vista Business (I rerouted the My Documents link in my
    >> previous Windows XP Pro installation to point there). The problem I have
    >> now
    >> is that all the permissions are set so that I cannot access files that
    >> were
    >> not explicitly created from my computer - ie, any files from like 10
    >> years
    >> ago created somewhere long time ago seem to have no ability with UAC on
    >> to be
    >> accessed. I have changed ownership on the entire My Documents folder and
    >> sub
    >> folders and files, as well as enabled Full Control permissions to all the
    >> files, but somehow Windows Vista doesn't recognize any of this and will
    >> not
    >> allow me to access the older files still. The only fix for this is to
    >> turn
    >> the entire UAC control off, but even so I can't modify the My Documents
    >> Folder to any effect or renaming, moving, etc. It regardless always
    >> appears
    >> as "read only" as well even though I persistantly uncheck it and save...
    >> any
    >> suggestions!?
     
    koze, Feb 22, 2007
    #4
  5. echostorm

    echostorm Guest

    I only have 1 account as listed in users - and it is theoretically an admin -
    i tried to transfer ownership using this account - it transfers, but still no
    access... what is the "real administrator" and how do I access that account?
    This is a home computer and I am the only user.

    "koze" wrote:

    > Then you have to take the ownership of that folder, including the ACL's and
    > that has to be done as the real administrator.
    > Not the build in admin. Add yourself to the owner of the folder include all
    > the security settings needed.
    > That can be done with the UAC normal on.
    >
    > Ko.
    >
    > "echostorm" <> schreef in bericht
    > news:...
    > > Unfortunately that is not my problem, Vista has already established a new
    > > path to "Documents" with some stuff being put in there from subsequent
    > > program installs. It's basically the My Documents folder(s) from previous
    > > computers that I just copied onto a secondary hard drive. I would rename
    > > My
    > > Documents to "Our Documents" or something had I have known Vista would
    > > treat
    > > "My Documents" differently. Unlike the knowledge base suggestions, my
    > > absolute path for the My Documents folder in trouble is F:\My Documents
    > > which
    > > was self created... Vista apparently has locked this folder from access
    > > with
    > > UAC, from modification without UAC.
    > >
    > > "echostorm" wrote:
    > >
    > >> HELP! This is driving me crazy. I have a My Documents folder on a 2nd
    > >> harddrive (F:\) that may have been part of the upgrade path from Windows
    > >> XP
    > >> Pro to Windows Vista Business (I rerouted the My Documents link in my
    > >> previous Windows XP Pro installation to point there). The problem I have
    > >> now
    > >> is that all the permissions are set so that I cannot access files that
    > >> were
    > >> not explicitly created from my computer - ie, any files from like 10
    > >> years
    > >> ago created somewhere long time ago seem to have no ability with UAC on
    > >> to be
    > >> accessed. I have changed ownership on the entire My Documents folder and
    > >> sub
    > >> folders and files, as well as enabled Full Control permissions to all the
    > >> files, but somehow Windows Vista doesn't recognize any of this and will
    > >> not
    > >> allow me to access the older files still. The only fix for this is to
    > >> turn
    > >> the entire UAC control off, but even so I can't modify the My Documents
    > >> Folder to any effect or renaming, moving, etc. It regardless always
    > >> appears
    > >> as "read only" as well even though I persistantly uncheck it and save...
    > >> any
    > >> suggestions!?

    >
    >
    >
     
    echostorm, Feb 22, 2007
    #5
  6. echostorm

    koze Guest

    If you right click on the folder do you see the tab "Security" ? select
    that tab and in there you can take control of all the security settings. You
    may need elevated rights to do so, if UAC is on you will be prompted to do
    so.
    Then you have the real administrator settings active and can change the
    security settings to your own account with full control.


    "echostorm" <> schreef in bericht
    news:...
    >I only have 1 account as listed in users - and it is theoretically an
    >admin -
    > i tried to transfer ownership using this account - it transfers, but still
    > no
    > access... what is the "real administrator" and how do I access that
    > account?
    > This is a home computer and I am the only user.
    >
    > "koze" wrote:
    >
    >> Then you have to take the ownership of that folder, including the ACL's
    >> and
    >> that has to be done as the real administrator.
    >> Not the build in admin. Add yourself to the owner of the folder include
    >> all
    >> the security settings needed.
    >> That can be done with the UAC normal on.
    >>
    >> Ko.
    >>
    >> "echostorm" <> schreef in bericht
    >> news:...
    >> > Unfortunately that is not my problem, Vista has already established a
    >> > new
    >> > path to "Documents" with some stuff being put in there from subsequent
    >> > program installs. It's basically the My Documents folder(s) from
    >> > previous
    >> > computers that I just copied onto a secondary hard drive. I would
    >> > rename
    >> > My
    >> > Documents to "Our Documents" or something had I have known Vista would
    >> > treat
    >> > "My Documents" differently. Unlike the knowledge base suggestions, my
    >> > absolute path for the My Documents folder in trouble is F:\My Documents
    >> > which
    >> > was self created... Vista apparently has locked this folder from access
    >> > with
    >> > UAC, from modification without UAC.
    >> >
    >> > "echostorm" wrote:
    >> >
    >> >> HELP! This is driving me crazy. I have a My Documents folder on a
    >> >> 2nd
    >> >> harddrive (F:\) that may have been part of the upgrade path from
    >> >> Windows
    >> >> XP
    >> >> Pro to Windows Vista Business (I rerouted the My Documents link in my
    >> >> previous Windows XP Pro installation to point there). The problem I
    >> >> have
    >> >> now
    >> >> is that all the permissions are set so that I cannot access files that
    >> >> were
    >> >> not explicitly created from my computer - ie, any files from like 10
    >> >> years
    >> >> ago created somewhere long time ago seem to have no ability with UAC
    >> >> on
    >> >> to be
    >> >> accessed. I have changed ownership on the entire My Documents folder
    >> >> and
    >> >> sub
    >> >> folders and files, as well as enabled Full Control permissions to all
    >> >> the
    >> >> files, but somehow Windows Vista doesn't recognize any of this and
    >> >> will
    >> >> not
    >> >> allow me to access the older files still. The only fix for this is to
    >> >> turn
    >> >> the entire UAC control off, but even so I can't modify the My
    >> >> Documents
    >> >> Folder to any effect or renaming, moving, etc. It regardless always
    >> >> appears
    >> >> as "read only" as well even though I persistantly uncheck it and
    >> >> save...
    >> >> any
    >> >> suggestions!?

    >>
    >>
    >>
     
    koze, Feb 22, 2007
    #6
  7. Re: Was HELP! Vista BUG: My Documents on 2nd HD - No Permissions Now changing UAC (User Account Control) basics

    On Thu, 22 Feb 2007 13:10:24 -0800, echostorm
    <> wrote:

    >I only have 1 account as listed in users - and it is theoretically an admin -
    >i tried to transfer ownership using this account - it transfers, but still no
    >access... what is the "real administrator" and how do I access that account?
    >This is a home computer and I am the only user.


    According to Microsoft this is a "feature" not a bug. Time permitting
    over the next week or so I'll write a more detailed how-to about UAC
    and post it in the microsoft general group. If I don't get a chance
    this pretty much gives the basic steps for simpler setup like single
    user PC's.

    Till then...

    Go to the UAC (User Account Control) from Control Panel, User Groups.
    Click on where it says Turn User Account Control on or off, and
    uncheck the on option if it is already (default) checked.

    If you want to play with it while it is still on, the glaring thing I
    first seen is a DESIGN issue. Maybe I'm justing messing up, easy to
    do, as you'll see in a minute if you keep reading.

    If your click on the folder or application you wish to change
    permissions on by right clicking on its properties then the security
    tab you see a fairly complex window open up that displays in a top and
    bottom section. What's confusing to me at least at first is the EDIT
    button. This only effects the top section or groups or user names, not
    actually change the permissions which is probably what you're trying
    to do most of the time. To do that click on the Advanced tab.

    Try this experiment yourself and see if you get similar results before
    you mess up any of your actual folders or applications. Just create a
    new folder, dump a few images or text files in it then rename the
    folder to experiment or whatever you want to call it.

    For example I created a new folder on my C drive I called experiment.
    If I right click on that new folder's properties, then its Security
    tab, without any interaction from me Vista added four user classes.

    1. Authneticated Users
    2. System
    3. Administrators
    4. Users

    If you click on the edit button hoping to change permissions like it
    says, a new window opens but it probably won't let you change the
    permissions, it just shows them. If you try to make changes from here
    they likely will be just grayed out check marks.

    Instead click on Advanced. Yet another window opens. You see the four
    users from the previous Window listed, their general permission class,
    who they inherited the permissions from and what it applies to.

    Changes you make in this context is limited to the "user" you are
    trying to effect that likely before you start has limted permissions.

    In my experiment Vista says Authenticated users have a modifed
    permission, while system and Administrators have full control and
    Users have only read and execute control.

    *Note... these kinds of permissions may be perfectly fine depending on
    what the drive, folder or application needs to do. What Vista
    thinks it needs in the way of permissions can vary from what
    YOU think or need or what the enderlying application needs.
    Hence why you're probably getting errors.

    Now what has got to confuse a lot of people that never done this
    before is if you have administrative rights unlike before in XP where
    you could pretty much change anything, in Vista you first need to
    "take over" the user that doesn't have rights you wish to give it. So
    in effect you (as administrator) become the user who's rights you are
    going to change. You still need to be a administrator to do the
    following. If if you are logged in as a user that doesn't have
    administrative rights, you first need to log in with a user that does
    have administrative rights just like before in XP in order to effect
    system changes.

    Here's how I did that:

    1. I clicked on 'Users' that presently just has read & execute
    permissions.

    2. While 'Users' is hightlighted click Edit. A fourth window opens.

    3. Again click on the line that shows users, then the Edit button.

    4. A fifth window opens, actually the same one that before only showed
    grayed out permissions, only now you can change things.

    5. Under the allow column check the permissions you wish to give to
    'users'. I elected to give Full control.

    ** Users in this context can also be confusing. What you actual see
    may be the word users if Vista added the "user" or actual names you
    may have set up as users of your PC.

    6. Once you've changed the permissions, click ok to close this Window.
    Important, we now need to backout of this mess of windows and
    remember to click ok or apply as we go.

    7. Click the apply button from the previous window, then ok.

    8. Click ok again on the next window you now see.

    9. Click ok to close the properties tab.

    10.(optional) curse Microsoft for making this so damn lame and this
    was a easy one, it can get harder.

    Now right click on the folder you created that you renamed experiment
    or whatever you decided to call it, select properties, then the
    security tab again. If you did everything right now 'users' or
    whatever user name you have that had limited permissions now should
    show it has full control or total permission to do whatever it needs
    to and should run as it did under XP.

    Now you see why for most people probably a lot simple to just turn off
    UAC. There is a good side to all this if you take the time you can
    assign very specific rights which in theory at least should make your
    PC more secure for outside attack or does it?

    Well not really. Microsoft has admitted to avoid making this too
    complex as if what you just went through was easy, that admit they
    allow any application that claims to be a setup.exe have full rights.
    This more or less defeats the whole purpose.

    Read more on that juicy topic here:

    http://blogs.zdnet.com/security/?p=29&tag=nl.e589

    http://theinvisiblethings.blogspot.com/2007/02/vista-security-model-big-joke.html
     
    Adam Albright, Feb 22, 2007
    #7
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