Long delay before the updates appear

Discussion in 'Windows Update' started by davexnet, Aug 10, 2006.

  1. davexnet

    davexnet Guest

    Hello, I'm accessing WU from IE6. I'm using this path:
    ie6/tools/windows update/express.

    When I hit express, I get the animation with the green bars as it does
    it's thing.
    Problem is it takes 6 or 7 minutes before the list appears.
    While I was waiting, I used task manager (in windows 2000) to look at
    cpu
    utilization. One of the svchost.exe was using 98% the whole time.
    I opened up sysinternals process explorer and see that this svchost is
    associated with
    wuauserv.

    After about 7 minutes the list appears and I hit "install". The
    progress box appears,
    and I see the update downloading one at a time. Then it says
    "initializing installation"
    (or similar). Here it takes another 6 or 7 minutes before anthing
    happens. Once again
    svchost/wuauser is using all the cpu. Eventually, everything installs
    normally.

    Any troubleshooting advice appreciated.
    Thanks,
    Dave
     
    davexnet, Aug 10, 2006
    #1
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  2. davexnet

    NewScience Guest

    That is how it's suppose to work ... even though it takes a long time (on
    some connections).

    There are many variables involved:

    1. Your connection speed
    2. Your CPU
    3. The load on MS server
    4. The number of servers you go thru to get there.

    That's just the connection side. The communication side is just as
    involving:

    1. Once you get connected up, svchost and wuaclt.exe talk with the other
    side and pass initial information back and forth. The basically use the
    information in your C:\Windows\SoftwareDistribution\DataStore\DataStore.edb
    file. This is a multi-partitioned file ... to view it use esentutl and dump
    the meta-data.

    The information is basically history information that is compared with the
    info on MS. In this fashion, this is the only way MS determines what you
    have and don't have. It also initially determines if your Update software
    is up-to-date, in order to determine if it needs to update that first.

    This is the first 6-7 minutes ... the more updates you have the longer it
    takes.

    Once the history is determined, MS then determines of the updates available,
    which ones are pertinent to your system.

    Then it initializes the Installation procedure and goes thru a series of
    downloading packets to the C:\Windows\SoftwareDistribution\Download folder
    as well as keeping the DataStore.edb file up-to-date as it proceeds.

    Once everything is downloaded, it then proceeds to install. Each folder
    normally has a update folder that contains an update.exe and some *.inf
    file. The *.inf file contains the information on reboot instructions
    (whether the system should reboot after installation), and/or registry
    modifications. All this information is logged in a C:\Windows\KB*.log file
    as well as the C:\Windows\WindowsUpdate.log.

    Once all this is done, the notification that the installations have been
    performed and whether or not the system needs to be rebooted. If I'm doing
    a manual download/install, I normally chose the Close button, so that I can
    see the results of the downloads/installs. Then I manually reboot.

    The problem that arises is when DLLs are not re-registered (when in one of
    the packages), you run out of space, or you receive a partial download and
    the connection is broken.

    This really screws up the DataStore.edb file.

    Regardless, I have yet to see where the Download folder gets cleaned up
    after successful installs and you have these packages sitting around takeing
    up space. Supposedly, I believe I read somewhere, where these folders/files
    are removed after 45 days. Haven't seen it, but really haven't kept tabs.
     
    NewScience, Aug 10, 2006
    #2
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  3. davexnet

    dave xnet Guest

    On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 02:14:36 -0400, "NewScience"
    Thanks for this detailed background. It's good info, but I don't
    see an answer to my problem here. See below.
    Is this where I'm seeing 98% of the cpu consumed for 6 minutes?
    This is not normal, it can't be.
    I deleted the whole datastore, it still took 6 minutes, so I put the
    old datastore back (my history was gone. It's a long history too,
    255 updates since Nov 2000 ) Once I put it back, history restored.
    After my updates were downloaded, as I said, another 6 or 7 minutes
    was consumed while the process was "initializing"
    Thanks for all this great info - One last thing, I'm on a dual boot
    system. Win2k having the problem. However, if I boot 98SE,
    ie6 / WU proceeds in a much more timely fashion.
    The "checking for updates" takes about 25 seconds.
    Dave
     
    dave xnet, Aug 10, 2006
    #3
  4. davexnet

    NewScience Guest

    Plus you don't have all the overhead that comes from each and better Windows
    system ... let alone sizes of critical updates and the amount size of the
    DataStore.edb file.

    Plus, I'm sure that your Windows 98SE and Windows 2000 are not identical in
    nature as far as third-party applications and memory utilization procedures.
     
    NewScience, Aug 10, 2006
    #4
  5. davexnet

    dave xnet Guest

    Of course not, 98se, is a slightly older install, and it has more
    "Stuff" on it. On the otherhand, my win2k is fairly lean.

    Using process explorer I can see that all the cpu is being exhausted
    in a thread called RtlpWorkerThread.
    Unfortunately, I'm not a windows programmer, so the significance
    of that is not apparent.
    Dave
     
    dave xnet, Aug 10, 2006
    #5
  6. davexnet

    Steve A Guest

     
    Steve A, Aug 11, 2006
    #6
  7. davexnet

    Steve A Guest

    Hi,
    I have been suffering the same problem. Not only does it take a long time,
    but svchost uses up to 98% of CPU utilization, ensuring you can do nothing
    else for that time.

    Also, I have three PCs connected through the same Internet connection and
    only one of them suffers this problem. I have had to turn off automatic
    updates to stop it from randomly hogging my CPU. But every time I use MS
    Update or Windows Update on this PC, the same thing happens every time.

    If it IS the way it is supposed to work, it is a very poor piece of
    engineering and needs to be fixed. (No app should hog 98% of CPU). But as
    this delay does not happen on all PCs it would indicate that there is another
    problem somewhere.

    I'd certainly like to hear from anyone who has been able to overcome this
    issue.

    Cheers, Steve A
     
    Steve A, Aug 11, 2006
    #7
  8. davexnet

    dave xnet Guest

    Here's a few things I tried.
    First I ran an ie6 repair. Didn't do anything that I
    could detect.
    Next I ran SFC /SCANNOW. This process restored
    the "proper" version of a couple of files, 'cause their
    digital signatures were wrong.

    When I tried ie6/tools/WU/express again, it
    recommended I apply the sp4 rollup 1
    (I'm using windows 2000) and some other ie6 security
    fix which I had installed ages ago... Apparently, the files
    restored by SFC /scannow had regressed something.

    Before downloading those updates, I opened up a CMD
    box and ran qfecheck.. This told me that 5 or 6 fixes
    should be reapplied.

    I downloaded and installed the fixes suggrested by WU,
    installed and rebooted. Windows update/express still takes
    a while, but it seems quicker than before. About 1 1/2 - 2
    minutes.

    Oh before I forget, I also did the ntfs permissions as suggested by
    this http://support.microsoft.com/kb/909444/en-us
    My permissions were wrong (can't hurt).
    Something for you to check !
    Dave
     
    dave xnet, Aug 13, 2006
    #8
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