Microsoft's Response?

Discussion in 'Internet Explorer' started by John R, Nov 8, 2006.

  1. John R

    Gordon Guest

    Gordon, Nov 8, 2006
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  2. John wrote on Wed, 8 Nov 2006 02:44:02 -0800:
    I don't trust other non-MS applications I use to be compatible. I also write
    my own software too, and have a lot of bespoke systems that I need to test
    them with before roll-out to the rest of the company. Blindly installing
    updates might be fine for home users who on the whole might have very little
    software that relies on specific versions of system files, but it's
    definitely not recommended in a business environment.

    Daniel Crichton, Nov 8, 2006
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  3. John R

    Col Guest

    Just to be 100% fair i formatted my test sytem and reinstalled XP Home
    Edition and Service Pack 2, now its got over 1GB of RAM and fast Graphics,
    all the usual stuff and a 2.6GHZ processor, i left off all software inc AV.
    now...... low and behold after installation it still manages to F*** up my
    taskbar and desktop icons. (totally slows them to a crawl)
    So, thanks but no thanks. FIX IT FIRST and i might use it.
    Col, Nov 8, 2006
  4. John R

    Jack Ryan Guest

    To MOST people, the term Automatic Update implies that the install will
    result in a 100% complete and workable application. Any 'third-party'
    item conflicts, hardware conflicts (HP print/scan), etc. should be
    addressed during the install. The install should do a pre-test and
    advise if there are potential problems. The user can then elect to
    rectify said conflicts or refuse the install. During the install it
    should provide further, mid-install, notices of any potential problems.
    Again, allowing the user to proceed or no.
    Jack Ryan, Nov 8, 2006
  5. John R

    Jack Ryan Guest

    "Millions"? My bet is (maybe) thousands. Most likely not even 10s of
    thousands. NO way is it millions (plural)!
    Jack Ryan, Nov 8, 2006
  6. John R

    Jack Ryan Guest

    In this case it appears MS intentionally did not play fair with others.
    They want THEIR own firewall, anti-virus, anti-spyware, anti-phishing,
    media player, toolbars, etc. to be what's used.

    Along comes General Motors and it buys Shell Oil. Driver X trades in
    his old vehicle (IE6) for a new model (IE7). He then proceeds to an
    Exxon station and fills the tank. His vehicle won't start. He calls
    GM. They tell him he HAS to use Shell gasoline. They also tell him,
    that in order to get his car running again, he will need to remove the
    gas tank, purge it, fill it with Shell gas, have the vehicle towed to a
    GM dealer where a tech makes repairs and adjustments.

    If the new vehicle is going to be required to use Shell gas the buyer
    should have been informed prior/during the purchase.

    If IE7 is not going to play with any/all the add-ons, hardware,
    software, etc. that IE6 did the user should be informed prior to, or
    during, the install.
    Jack Ryan, Nov 8, 2006
  7. Jack wrote on Wed, 08 Nov 2006 08:42:52 -0800:
    In an ideal world. Have you seen any operating system that does what you
    have described? Debian certainly doesn't via apt-get, it just installs all
    the modules when you tell to and does no checking. Actually, it has a habit
    of removing needed modules when you remove something you don't want any
    more, so it fails to even check whether other installed applications refer
    to the same modules. At least with most Windows installers I get a warning
    if the installer wants to remove a DLL that another application is still
    referencing (so long as the installers for those applications updated the
    reference count in the registry correctly). There is no perfect system.

    Daniel Crichton, Nov 8, 2006
  8. John R

    HeyBub Guest

    Assuming people without problems have little incentive to post here, my
    tabulation of the vote is:

    Problems: 644
    No problems: 137,477,112

    I'm not in Florida.
    HeyBub, Nov 8, 2006
  9. John R

    Tom Willett Guest

    I know countless people who have no idea there are MS newsgroups. So, why
    would they post?
    They're just simple, out of the box users.


    | Assuming people without problems have little incentive to post here, my
    | tabulation of the vote is:
    | Problems: 644
    | No problems: 137,477,112
    | I'm not in Florida.
    Tom Willett, Nov 8, 2006
  10. John R

    Sirc Guest

    Well I just sort of stumbled into this site, but I had a problem. It is
    posted above. I don't think unsophisticated users would know about this
    site. So don't delude yourself into thinking 644 problems to 137,477,112 no
    Sirc, Nov 8, 2006
  11. John R

    Gordon Guest

    This is NOT a "site" - it's a Usenet News group.
    Gordon, Nov 8, 2006
  12. There an old piece of wisdom that states "For every person that says
    something, there are 10 who remain silent" Except that in the Internet
    world, that number is more like 100, or 1,000 or 10,000! I found these
    boards after searching for almost an hour for a place to let my
    dissatisfaction be heard, but I seriously doubt that most people will have
    the endurance to make it here.
    The_Pale_Blue_Dot, Nov 8, 2006
  13. John R

    xiowan Guest

    Hi All:
    Not that it matters, but I agree that I expected IE 7 to work without a
    lot of problems when I installed it. Well, I did have a lot of problems(see
    my 11/6 post for a few laughs). I have never installed an internet browser
    before. Internet explorer came with my first computer as part of the Win98
    O.S., then it came as part of the operating system installed on my XP Media
    Center 2005 computer in 2005. It always just worked fine and I did install
    many automatic updates for Int.Explorer during those years and had no (NO)
    problems. Little did I know that it's a different story to completely
    replace your browser with an all new one. When I downloaded IE7 from the
    update site it "asked me what search engine I wanted and I just checked a box
    that said Google. If they knew from their Beta testing that it could cause
    the kind of problems I had, they certainly should have not made it seem like
    a simple "check-this-box" installation. For all I knew they were including
    the perfect version of google with the download and I thot that was very
    accomodating. If I had checked on the Internet Explorer Download site for
    special instructions, I probably wouldn't have had so many problems. I am
    going to mention some "Big Names" in the computer world and ask why Internet
    Explorer is not working with their software and why if they couldn't be ready
    when IE 7 came out that Microsoft doesn't specifically mention that MILLIONS
    of people have software that is incompatible with IE 7 BEFORE we install it.
    INTEL (my chipset bios & monitoring software), NORTON (my
    anti-virus/firewall), MacAfee (my anti-virus/firewall on another computer),
    GOOGLE (the world's biggest search engine & mine), US ROBOTICS(my modem
    drivers downloaded a week before IE7 install) even MSN(their own internet
    provider)........all went whacky upon installation of IE7. We're talking
    about the some of the largest companies in the computer world, used in
    millions of computers and I just don't understand the lack of cooperation and
    pre-warnings of compatibility problems IE 7. I certainly didn't expect the
    installation to cause me to lose my modem, my network connection to an
    Xbox360, my chipset monitoring software to get corrupted and my cpu to go
    into a state of 50-97% capacity with one window and the chipset monitoring
    software program running. If I ran Microsoft and knew it didn't work right
    with so many major products, I would make sure the installation contained
    EXPLICIT warnings not to install it if your computer uses any other major
    companies' software without updating to IE7 compatible first! Not everyone
    in the world is an expert on all aspects of a computer....most just turn it
    on and expect it to work. tucson
    xiowan, Nov 8, 2006
  14. John R

    Sirc Guest

    LOL, yes this is a Microsoft discussion group, but it is still an internet
    Sirc, Nov 8, 2006
  15. John R

    Gordon Guest

    No it's NOT. This is a USENET newsgroup which just happens to have a
    horrible web interface as well. LOL. (pathetic LOL)
    Gordon, Nov 8, 2006
  16. John R

    jonah Guest

    Mike I did just that last week by accident, did a re-format re-install
    for a friend with severe malware problems. Prior to re-format I used
    Driver Genius Pro to copy all the drivers present to a CDR as a
    backup. On re-install I found I did not have the original driver disk
    for the printer so on a whim instead of getting drivers from HP I
    stuck the backup disk in to see what happened.

    The printer found drivers and installed them , print and scan only (HP
    PSC 1310) and it worked kind of but was obviously not installed
    properly and did not work correctly. Anyway with a bit of fiddling I
    could have probably fixed it all up, I had printing and scanning
    running OK after a fashion but it kept stalling and giving error

    In the end I re-installed a recent image and got the basic drivers
    from HP mainly because I did not want to spend the time on this issue
    whilst being given constant earache about when the PC would be ready.
    I will try it again though on one of my boxes next time I re-install

    jonah, Nov 9, 2006
  17. John R

    jonah Guest

    Yer know thats exactly what Linux distro package mangers do. They
    handle system updates and software installation almost exactly as you
    have described above.


    jonah, Nov 9, 2006
  18. John R

    jonah Guest

    Well yeah I have - YUM on Fedora Core 5 & 6 and Zen / Yast on Suse
    10.1, neither are foolproof but they do a great job of checking
    dependancies and flagging possible conflicts before installing the
    packages. Never used apt-get or Debian yet I have enough headaches
    with Suse and Fedora but I have rarely had an update go badly wrong
    except for the first version of Suse 10.1 which was fixed fairly

    And you are right Dan there is no perfect system however I think
    trying to go forwards and improve is the goal, MSFT seems to regularly
    get this backwards, of course they get a lot more flack for every
    mishap than a Linux distro would because they are a big target and few
    novice users can handle the culture shock of Linux, so the people that
    do play with it don't get as annoyed when things go a bit pear shaped.

    jonah, Nov 9, 2006
  19. John R

    jonah Guest

    Obviously not it would be much closer.


    jonah, Nov 9, 2006
  20. John R

    nethinim Guest

    mr hall i believe if you do a minimum installation you will not get the other
    software i.e. hp director, photo and imaging, memories dsc creator, share to
    the web etc. i also like HP printers, however you get used to the way
    pictures are downloaded for example. out of ten computers i only have issue
    with one which has both hp camera software and hp printer software. IE7
    becomes non functional after i download pictures and i must reboot to access
    the web through IE7. i do get disturbed at being told to do spyware witch
    hunting. someone between MS and these other perifferal companies dropped the
    ball though, it is easy to blame a users PC that it is infected than to be
    responsible, admit there are issues, and attempt to resolve those issues for
    us the end user. recently at windows update i downloades 4 hardware updates
    for hp, usr, and dlink. thinking that IE7 issues would be resolved. all four
    failed and left my modem, printer, and wireless addapter non functional. mr
    hall we are not all MVP'S and are sometimes overwhelemed when these issues
    arise. so what we need is good, FREE, support from MS, HP and OTHERS. i am
    florred by the fact that HP has no support od drivers for vista os and if i
    upgraded i would only have basic function of hp perifferals. I like IE7 and
    have come up with my own work around. but i should not have to.
    thank you for helping and being an MVP i appreciate all you do
    nethinim, Feb 19, 2007
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