Vista Home Premium

Discussion in 'Windows Vista Security' started by AliceZ, Apr 29, 2008.

  1. AliceZ

    AliceZ Guest

    I just bought a Toshbia A305 S6825 notebook with Vista Premium sp1 (which I
    was told had good security programs installed) and someone told me yesterday
    that the Firewall on Virsta Premium is not (very) effective. They suggested I
    should use the (new) ZA (which is about 45MB, so they say). They mentioned
    that they used "ShieldsUP" to test Vista Premium's Firewall and found a
    "ping" (don't know what that is!) got through.

    Does anyone have any thoughts/suggestions about the Vista Home Premium's
    Firewall? Or is this just too "hi tech" for me to get worried about now since
    I just bought the new Toshiba with Vista Home Premium sp1 and since I am a
    novice at all of this? I am trying to learn so much, as soon as possible,
    which is a bit confusing and daunting
     
    AliceZ, Apr 29, 2008
    #1
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  2. I am using Vista Ultimate and only use the Windows Vista Firewall however,
    my broadband connection does work through a modem/router (the router
    effectively being a hardware firewall rather than software). The 'ping' you
    refer to from ShieldUp simply means that the ShieldsUp program managed to
    get through the firewall and register your IP address.

    While I use Vista's firewall I have also always been an advocate of Zone
    Alarm (the free version). If you feel worried or threatened by what you read
    regarding firewalls and want to make the change, the by all means download
    Zone Alarm (free version) I would certainly recommend it.


    --
    --
    John Barnett MVP
    Associate Expert
    Windows Desktop Experience

    Web: http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org
    Web: http://vistasupport.mvps.org

    The information in this mail/post is supplied "as is". No warranty of any
    kind, either expressed or implied, is made in relation to the accuracy,
    reliability or content of this mail/post. The Author shall not be liable for
    any direct, indirect, incidental or consequential damages arising out of the
    use of, or inability to use, information or opinions expressed in this
    mail/post..
     
    John Barnett MVP, Apr 29, 2008
    #2
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  3. There is nothing wrong with Vista's built-in firewall.
    However, for maximum protection, consider installing
    a comprehensive anti-virus/security program, such as
    Windows OneCare. You can try it FREE for 90 days.
    http://onecare.live.com/standard/en-us/default.htm

    --
    Carey Frisch
    Microsoft MVP
    Windows Desktop Experience -
    Windows Vista Enthusiast

    ---------------------------------------------------------------

    :

    I just bought a Toshbia A305 S6825 notebook with Vista Premium sp1 (which I
    was told had good security programs installed) and someone told me yesterday
    that the Firewall on Virsta Premium is not (very) effective. They suggested I
    should use the (new) ZA (which is about 45MB, so they say). They mentioned
    that they used "ShieldsUP" to test Vista Premium's Firewall and found a
    "ping" (don't know what that is!) got through.

    Does anyone have any thoughts/suggestions about the Vista Home Premium's
    Firewall? Or is this just too "hi tech" for me to get worried about now since
    I just bought the new Toshiba with Vista Home Premium sp1 and since I am a
    novice at all of this? I am trying to learn so much, as soon as possible,
    which is a bit confusing and daunting
     
    Carey Frisch [MVP], Apr 29, 2008
    #3
  4. AliceZ

    AliceZ Guest

    Just wanted to mention that I tried the Shields Up not only on the Toshiba
    notebook with Vista Home Premium Sp1 (with also AVG-AV; AVG-AS, SpyBlaster),
    but also on our WinXPsp2 desktop which has NAV (AVG-AS; AdAware, SpyBlaster)
    and that also showed the same "ping" thing.
     
    AliceZ, Apr 29, 2008
    #4
  5. AliceZ

    AliceZ Guest

    Sorry - forgot to mention that I also use DSL.

     
    AliceZ, Apr 29, 2008
    #5
  6. Carey Frisch [MVP], Apr 29, 2008
    #6
  7. AliceZ

    Alun Jones Guest

    ShieldsUP is written by Steve Gibson, whom some revere as a security genius,
    and the rest of us think he's a plagiarising idiot who doesn't know what
    he's talking about.

    It has been a long time since 'ping' was anything remotely like a security
    threat. I personally like keeping it in place, as it is used as a measure of
    network connectivity.

    The firewall in Windows Vista is sufficient for most purposes, and is
    configurable. ZoneAlarm (what 'ZA' usually stands for) is something of a
    fashion, and if you want a program that keeps asking "is it okay to let this
    application communicate to the Internet?", and believe that you can
    competently answer that question, then perhaps it's for you. However,
    Windows Vista's firewall does a thoroughly competent job of preventing
    traffic that you didn't invite.
    Perhaps now is not the time to be adding a new program that is going to
    assume you understand what you're doing?

    Make sure you keep patched, keep your anti-virus and anti-spyware updated
    (there are free anti-virus and anti-spyware programs, if you can't afford to
    keep current on the short-term subscription to whatever came with your
    system), and you should be ahead of most people.

    The big additional feature most people will suggest ZoneAlarm for is that of
    "outbound filtering". In an enterprise, this could be useful, in that it
    allows you to prevent policy-breaking programs from communicating outside
    the system - for a home user, it's "game over" already if you have an
    unauthorised program installed on your system. [And in an enterprise, there
    are better tools than ZoneAlarm available - an enterprise would not trust a
    potentially-malicious machine to police itself]

    Alun.
    ~~~~
     
    Alun Jones, Apr 29, 2008
    #7
  8. AliceZ

    vista_man Guest

    I have Vista Home Premium and use Sphinx Vista Firewall Control
    freeware version

    It works with Windows Firewall and you can control what goes _out_ fro
    your pc

    Done a ShieldsUp test and reports my pc is invisible ?

    Running, the program uses 3500k of memory (not much) and installs o
    disk using 1.90m

    In 12 months, it seems i have been well protected. Whether its Vist
    Firewall Control, Windows Firewall or the combination of the 2

    cheer
     
    vista_man, Apr 29, 2008
    #8
  9. what security programs are those?
    That's just the usual nonsense from clueless "outbound control"
    junkies.
    For what purpose? - For screwing up your network and making your
    system possibly more vulnerable? Fine - go ahead.
    Yes. Followers of Gibsons "stealthing" nonsense will often say
    something like that. They are mostly clueless security wannabees. As
    long as you're not exposing any open ports you should be fine.
    Responding to pings is not to be considered a security risk unless you
    believe in security theater.
    It's good enough.
    As a novice you should pay more attention to what you do, what sites
    you visit and so on. Don't click on everything you see and don't
    run/install/allow all kinds of crap from dubious sources.

    And most important: Keep your system patched.
     
    Straight Talk, Apr 29, 2008
    #9
  10. This indicates that your DSL thing is also a router, and ShieldsUp is
    actually testing this device and not your machine. Nonetheless no real
    issue.
     
    Straight Talk, Apr 29, 2008
    #10

  11. I disagree. I think the built-in Vista firewall is fine, and there's
    no reason to avoid using it. It's what I use.

    However, regarding having "good security programs installed," note
    that besides a firewall, you also need an anti-virus program, and at
    least two anti-spyware programs.

    Vista does *not* come with anti-virus software and you need to install
    a third-party product. I recommend either the freeware Avast, or
    ESET's NOD32, if you are willing to pay for one.

    Regarding anti-spyware, Vista comes with Windows Defender. It's OK,
    but note that just using one anti-spyware program is *not* good
    enough. Eric Howes, who has done extensive testing on Anti-Spyware
    products,
    states:

    "No single anti-spyware scanner removes everything. Even the
    best-performing anti-spyware scanner in these tests missed fully one
    quarter of the "critical" files and Registry entries" See
    http://spywarewarrior.com/asw-test-guide.htm

    I recommend that you use two or more of the following:

    Spybot Search and Destroy
    Adaware
    Spyware Blaster
    Windows Defender
    Super-Antispyware
     
    Ken Blake, MVP, Apr 29, 2008
    #11
  12. AliceZ

    AliceZ Guest

    I was referring to the Vista Home Premium Firewall, Defender, etc. Also, the
    AVG-AV; AVG-AS; SpyBlaster that I had installed by my son.
     
    AliceZ, Apr 29, 2008
    #12
  13. AliceZ

    AliceZ Guest

    Thanks
    i just mentioned the NAV on the desktop (which also got the 1 ping thing)
    because not only the Vista Home Premium sps1 (firewall) and the NAV showed
    this ping thing. I always get weekly updates for the NAV and then do full
    scan.
     
    AliceZ, Apr 29, 2008
    #13
  14. AliceZ

    windyvoice Guest

    Vista firewall is, by default, set to work on incoming only. It can be set
    to protect on outgoing, also, but can be confusing to a new user. There is
    some debate as to whether outgoing protection is even needed since incoming
    should not allow any nasties to enter. But firewalls are not 100% effective,
    no security is, of course. I like outgoing because I can see what or who is
    asking to connect and what program is trying to phone home. The bad guys
    come out with programs and viruses so fast it is hard for any security
    company to keep ahead of them so we are never completely safe online. It is
    a risk we all take just by connecting.

    According to leak tests, only a few free firewalls pass, Online Armor (not
    yet Vista Compatible) and Comodo Firewall Pro if you use the defense +
    security in version 3 (see Scot's Newsletter) (compatible if you use the
    latest version 3). The paid Zone Alarm passes, the free doesn't. Vista
    built in firewall doesn't pass the leak test but is usually enough for a
    home user, especially if you have a router. Any firewall, in training mode,
    will ask if you want to let a program connect if it has outgoing protection.

    http://blog.scotsnewsletter.com/2008/03/24/the-best-firewall-software-of-2008-online-armor/
    http://www.scotsnewsletter.com/index.htm
    http://www.matousec.com/info/articles/introduction-firewall-leak-testing.php

    Sphinx Vista Firewall Control can be used to adjust the Vista Firewall for
    both incoming and outgoing (outgoing lets you see if anything is trying to
    phone home but you need to know if the phoning is good or bad). I am using
    Comodo Firewall Pro free 3 (latest version) with AVG Antivirus (Avast and
    Anitvir free are better but don't play well with Comodo on my system).
    Comodo shows stealth on various test sites. I was using Kaspersky Internet
    Security 7 but it had problems with Vista that were just too annoying so it
    is working well on our WinXP computer.

    I do not like Norton anything. Symantec is very intrusive and uses lots of
    resources and memory. When I used it, our machine got infected several
    times. It never got an infection with Kaspersky but, as stated, had
    problems on this particular system. Do not run more than one AV at any
    time. If you want a second opinion Trend Micro's Online House Call can scan
    your system online and report any problems your installed AV may have
    missed. There are also other online scanners, but I can't remember the
    addresses. Maybe one of the MVPs can tell you.

    Trend Micro also has a free root-kit scanner called rootkitbuster. Spyware
    is a huge problem on the net and a good spyware program (such as Windows
    Defender) should help. There are other spyware programs you can use to scan
    as a second opinion. Hope this helps. Sorry for the long-windedness.
     
    windyvoice, Apr 29, 2008
    #14
  15. How do you manage to hit the right buttons when it's invisible?
    It's just the windows firewall in combination with your brain that has
    kept you protected. No need for all kinds of anti-crap.
     
    Straight Talk, Apr 29, 2008
    #15
  16. And soon your new turbo-machine is crippled with anti-crap.

    BTW, how would adding further potentially vulnerable code to an
    already vulnerable system actually increase it's security?
    I recommend keeping the bad stuff out instead. This is done mainly by
    staying away from inherently broken software, keeping ones system
    patched and using ones brain.
     
    Straight Talk, Apr 29, 2008
    #16

  17. All of those things are good to do. But relying on them alone is
    foolhardy.
     
    Ken Blake, MVP, Apr 29, 2008
    #17
  18. If so, so is relying on anti-crap.
     
    Straight Talk, Apr 29, 2008
    #18

  19. Which is precisely the job of a firewall--that and nothing more.
     
    Steve Riley [MSFT], Apr 30, 2008
    #19
  20. AliceZ

    Alun Jones Guest

    Strange - I thought the job of a firewall was to keep pestering the user:

    "You've clicked on a link from a stranger who promised you naked Russian
    tennis players, but might possibly infect your computer instead, do you
    really expect to see naked Russian tennis players?"

    .... and then expecting the user to pause for a moment's reflection before
    clicking "no, not really, I must have been confused".

    Anyone who believes that they will answer those questions correctly (and
    then will investigate why an unexpected outbound connection was initiated)
    might want something like ZoneAlarm.

    Alun.
    ~~~~
     
    Alun Jones, Apr 30, 2008
    #20
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