What a Wonderful World

Discussion in 'Windows Vista General Discussion' started by KRH, Dec 5, 2006.

  1. KRH

    KRH Guest

    Called Microsoft customer service with an upgrade question. The support rep
    had never heard of Microsoft Vista.

    Great training!

    This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the
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    KRH, Dec 5, 2006
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  2. KRH

    Chad Harris Guest

    So what was your precise Vista upgrade question and why didn't you
    incorporate it into the post?

    Don't Know Much About Geography but I know Indian Supprt Centers for

    And yawn-- this has nothing to do with my high regard for Indian people,
    first second, third whatever generation. It's the minium waged butts in
    seats that MFST puts in your face and on your PSS phone I mean via their
    Convergys contract that Redmond and Dallas campuses don't lift a finger to
    monitor or quality control.

    We all understand a high percentage of the Redmond campus has Indian of
    whatever generation makeup as do the tops of most American school systems at
    whatever level.

    The so-called "support" that you get when you call "MSFT" is a call center
    manned by Convergys of Ohio. This is because this is one distinct area
    where MSFT takes pleasure in straddling their customers and pissing on them.

    Convergys calls for the most part outsource to Indian call centers where the
    untrained individuals can barely find the start button.

    If you tell them you booted to Windows and can't find your user profile,
    they'll tell you to wipe the box aka format the box.

    They have no knowledge whatsoever of the non deletabel admin account in safe
    mode in Vista or XP.

    This is because MSFT has little regard for their customer base sub
    enterprise except that they want the money to go from your credit card or
    pocket to them.

    It's an egregious parody of "training" because MSFT wants to pay next to
    nothing for the contracts, and Convergys of Ohio is delighted to oblige.
    This hasn't changed for years. You wont' see anyone in here from Microsfot
    to defend it because it's one of many subjects they don't want to talk

    You will get excellent help for your question in groups like this one so
    take your questions here or to the appropriate MSFT Public group. The
    reason is that many of us know MSFT straddles and pisses on their customers
    and we want to keep you a little bit drier. We help because MSFT is
    incompetent in providing their subenterprise customers support.

    Chad Harris, Dec 5, 2006
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  3. KRH

    William Guest

    What country is their call canter located in?
    William, Dec 5, 2006
  4. KRH

    Chad Harris Guest

    They have several William. They have some call centers in the Seattle area.
    Many of the ones in the Seattle area screen eligibility for support or route
    the calls for other situations. They have a number in Canada. The quality
    of the Canadian support is better than India but the only way to go is up
    and depending on who is doing the supporot your milage could vary. I call to
    check them. I don't need their support for any issue whatsoever.

    Sometimes the Indian calls will screen eligibility for support and because
    of the language barrier, it can take 10 times as long just to get that done.
    Many times they won't say up front they are there to screen.

    That's not to say I don't have questions about issues with a pc or Windows;
    it's to say that they don't have anything that would remotely help me.

    When I first learned years ago how terrible support was, that was all the
    incentive I needed to get myself to a place where I didn't need it.

    But if you're in the United States, and I understand these newsgroups are
    represented by a large number of countries so I can't be sure of how many
    calls not from the US get routed, you're going predmoninantly to Convergys
    call centers in 5 very large Indian cities.

    They are very very difficult to understand for the most part, and because of
    that difficulty a lot is compromised in providing tech support. However this
    transcends language. If you pose basic Windows or Office problems to them,
    they are just not trained to handle them appropriately and there is a lot of
    what I call the "tooth pulling phenom."

    In most large American teaching hosptials where there is dental care, there
    is a sometimes terrible practice of pulling the patient's teeth rather than
    providing the appropriate care to fix the problem, because of lack of

    The downside to that is that many of those people can't eat well with no
    teeth and no substitutes for teeth once they are pulled or extracted.

    My analogy is that MSFT gets the boxes formatted through their piss poor
    Convergys contractors that they purport are providing support for a box of
    XP or Office or whatever they are calling that cute little package they are
    putting Vista in. If they gave a damn about support, they would have
    replaced Convergys of Ohio long ago. In fact they don't want to be
    bothered. It is interesting and I think there are some parallels that much
    has been written about Dell spending $100,000 on tech support. That sounds
    like a lot of money, but most major papers have written articles on it in
    my country.

    Again, you'll never find a MSFT employee who wants to touch this issue. You
    might get some Mickey Mouse thing from Mike Brannigan who seems to be having
    separation anxiety from his former MSFT employment.

    Chad Harris, Dec 5, 2006
  5. KRH

    William Guest

    My experience, since I do tech support for Comcast and Adelphia HSI is
    that those people, like myself, who are knowledgeable about computers
    and Windows tend to provide a very good level of support and will do
    their best troubleshooting a problem. Unfortunately there are far too
    many doing tech support who are more familiar with 'the hood' than how
    computers work.

    A month ago I had to deal with Charter HSI tech support because their
    was a DNS issue where I live. We have Charter for our ISP. Four out of
    five calls went to call centers in the Philippines. They were absolutely
    clueless. It was so easy to tell they were reading from a script and
    knew nothing that my wife, who has a hard time saving or opening a file,
    had them pegged right away. The other call went to a call center in
    Canada. The agent there was very intelligent and knowledgeable,
    especially when I told him that I was in the same business.
    William, Dec 5, 2006
  6. KRH

    Chad Harris Guest

    If I seemed to characterize all tech support with a broad brush stroke, that
    wasn't my intention William. But MSFT uses Convergys much of the time, and
    for my location most of it gets sent to India, and my Indian neighbor called
    them and said they couldn't speak English at all.

    They don't understand even the most basic situations with Windows, or
    Office. I understand they are supposed to have areas of expertise, but
    that's not what happens.

    Chad Harris, Dec 5, 2006
  7. KRH

    Al Guest

    I discovered an exploit a month ago in XP. I called Microsoft and got an
    operator in the US and I told him explicitly not to transfer my call
    overseas because it was a sensitive call regarding a security exploit and I
    needed the information to reach the right people. So what did he do? He sent
    my call to India! What an idiot!

    What's ironic is I live about 100 miles away from Microsoft headquarters in
    Redmond Washington. I told the Indian operator in detail what the problem
    was and they had no clue what I was saying and acted as though it wasn't
    serious. Even though it was and still is. I never called back and the
    vulnerability still exists.
    Al, Dec 5, 2006
  8. KRH

    Chad Harris Guest


    Windows is very vulnerable. It's Windows and that includes Vista for which
    Wagner Edstrom and McCann Ericson worldwide are goig to launch the mother of
    all ad campaigns touting security. But they would counter that with UAC,
    etc. that Security in Vista is more substantial than in XP and it is.

    If I lived 100 miles away from ole Redmond, Washington, some day when you
    were in the hood, I'd go right to Building 26 or whatever and tell them you
    wanted to see the weasles on campus responsible for coordinating their PSS.

    I think if you did this, you'd not only get the opportunity for some quality
    face time to give feedback to these weasles, but you would be able to have
    the experience of looking the Devil s and Devillesses (dudes and dudettes as
    they say in Redmond) in the eye and confronting him the way Keanu Reeves did
    with Al Pacino so many times in the movie

    Devil's Advocate

    They'll tell you if they talk to you with a straight face that they quality
    control their PSS. Ask them where the language class is for understanding
    that jibberish that the minimum waged butts in seats Indians at Convergys
    speak, and ask them what is it that Convergys has on Ballmer, Gates,
    Sinofsky and Raikes that locks them into that contract year after years when
    they know the PSS is so horrendous.

    Ask them to let you make a tech support call on speaker phone in front of
    them where you pose the question "I booted to Windows but my user profile is
    gone" and enjoy the fun.

    Chad Harris, Dec 5, 2006
  9. KRH

    Alias Guest

    Alias, Dec 5, 2006
  10. KRH

    Alias Guest

    What with the weak dollar, MS should move to Europe and outsource to the
    States, although it might be easier to understand an Indian accent than
    someone from Kentucky, Mississippi or Alabama.

    Alias, Dec 5, 2006
  11. KRH

    Al Guest


    Well I'm not loosing any sleep over it just disappointed. Microsoft is a
    mess of bad decisions. A shame really to be so out of touch with what's
    Al, Dec 5, 2006
  12. KRH

    MICHAEL Guest

    While a weak dollar may have its drawbacks (for the US), it has been
    a boon to US exporters. Not widely discussed because the trade deficit
    continues to be enormous (Americans just love to consume crap, and
    because of oil prices) but US exports continue to set records, it happened
    again last month. While Germany overtook the US in 2003 as the world's
    largest exporter (no, it's not China, not yet), the US set an export record
    in 2005 and is on pace to do it again this year. The US may also, barely,
    regain the top exporter spot over Germany in 2006.

    Of course, because Americans are just consuming piglets (the rest of the
    world should be thankful) the US also has the world's largest trade deficit.

    US exporters keep praying that the dollar stays low.

    Oh, US tourism also prays for a falling dollar.

    There's good and bad associated with a surging dollar and
    a falling dollar.


    November 27, 2006 -- A depressed dollar is turning Fifth Avenue into a virtual flea market for
    global travelers as strong currencies like the British pound and the euro create a glut of
    great deals on fashions, electronics and hot status brands.
    New York City is celebrating a record year from foreign tourists hitting town for weak dollar
    bargains - reaping savings of about one-third of what they'd spend back home.

    Their bargain boom is fueled by the falling dollar, whose value in the past year is down 12
    percent against the pound and off 10 percent against the euro, boosting foreign travelers'
    purchasing power.

    The dollar fell last week to its weakest level in 19 months, trading at $1.31 against the euro
    and at $1.93 against the pound. Analysts expect the greenback to slide as much as another 2
    percent this week.

    For the record 7.3 million foreign tourists expected to visit the Big Apple this year, the weak
    dollar is creating savings substantial enough to nearly pay for the trip itself.

    For example, the Microsoft Zune player - a rival to Apple's iPod - sells for $442 in London but
    can be found in New York stores for about $249, a savings of $193. That's about one-third of
    the price of the lowest New York-London airfare offered by bookers on the Internet.

    Stocking up on shoes and dresses could also cover the typical $300 nightly hotel tab.

    A mini-dot jersey dress sells at Saks Fifth Avenue for about $425, but an equivalent dress
    would cost about $580 at Selfridges in London. At Dixons, a popular London electronics
    retailer, a Panasonic mini camcorder costs the equivalent of $1,368, but can be bought at J&R
    near City Hall for just $999.99.

    And it's not only New York City that stands to benefit. European tour operators are said to be
    packaging shopping tours for U.S. cities - including weekend sprees in such hard-core retail
    destinations as the Mall of America in Minnesota, the world's largest shopping center - where
    three nonstop flights arrive daily from Europe.

    "They're giving European travelers any reason they can think of to get on a plane," said
    aviation analyst Terry Trippler.

    Although New York's economy is cashing in big, with an estimated record of $24 billion spent in
    tourist dollars this year, the nation's overall economy could suffer from the weak greenback.

    MICHAEL, Dec 5, 2006
  13. KRH

    Nina DiBoy Guest

    And they have been a mess of bad decisions for a while:


    Priceless quotes in m.p.w.vista.general group:

    "Price is actually no factor in piracy..." spoken by
    Mike Brannigan

    "But I'm not insulting people. I'm insulting Linux Loonies..."
    spoken by Mike <>
    Nina DiBoy, Dec 5, 2006
  14. KRH

    Alias Guest

    Yeah, the Federal Reserve Notes are checks written on a bank with no
    funds. Not good for the economy even if some stores are getting more of
    these checks than before. The dollar is not backed by *anything* but faith.

    Alias, Dec 5, 2006
  15. KRH

    Chad Harris Guest

    I feel confident in stating this was a good song and still is (sung by Art
    Garfunkel and Sam Cooke) and that if you rip this song to Vista it works 3
    times as well:

    What A Wonderful World (Lyrics)
    by Art Garfunkel

    (H. Alpert, L. Adler, S. Cooke)

    What a wonderful, wonderful, world this would be
    What a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful, wonderful world.
    Don't know much about history
    Don't know much biology
    Don't know much about science fic
    Don't know much about the French I took
    But I do know that I love you
    And I know that if you love me too
    What a wonderful, wonderful world this would be.

    Don't know much about geography
    Don't know much trigonometry
    Don't know much about algebra
    I don't know what a slide rule is for
    But I do know one and one is two
    And if this one could be with you
    What a wonderful, wonderful world this would be
    What a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful world.

    Now I don't claim to be an 'A' student,
    But I'm trying to be
    I think that maybe by being an 'A' student, baby babe,
    I could win your love for me.
    Don't know much about the middle ages
    Looked at the picture and I turned the pages
    Don't know nothin' 'bout no rise and fall
    Don't know nothin' 'bout nothin' at all
    Girl it's you that I've been thinking of
    And if I could only win your love, girl
    What a wonderful, wonderful world this would be
    What a wonderful, wonderful world this would be
    What a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful, wonderful world
    What a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful, wonderful world
    What a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful, wonderful world...
    Chad Harris, Dec 5, 2006
  16. KRH

    xfile Guest


    Can I have the permission for borrowing the lines?
    xfile, Dec 6, 2006
  17. KRH

    KRH Guest

    You bet. Now appearing at the MicroLounge Tuesday evenings. LOL
    KRH, Dec 6, 2006
  18. KRH

    xfile Guest

    LOL, thanks :)

    xfile, Dec 6, 2006
  19. KRH

    Chad Harris Guest

    *Very well done. You have a bright future either in

    a) poetry writing
    b) song writing
    c) have you seen what makes millions plus all the bling you can sling at any
    of these hip hop dominated music awards shows like Bill Board last night?
    d) all the above

    Chad Harris, Dec 6, 2006
  20. KRH

    Alan Guest


    What strikes me as being so ironic about all this is that many of the
    MVPs -- as well as other contributors to these MSFT newsgroups -- have been
    stating that it was worth it to pay extra dollars for regular retail
    versions of XP versus buying OEM copies.

    I'm not sure if there will be so-called OEM versions of Vista, but if there
    are I'm wondering if these same people will claim that it's worth it to pay
    extra dollars for regular retail versions of Vista rather than buying OEM
    copies because of "Microsoft support."

    Given what we know about the quality of service, "Microsoft support" surely
    doesn't sound like any incentive to me.

    Alan, Dec 6, 2006
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