What is populating Microsoft Windows Network?

Discussion in 'Server Networking' started by TurboT, Jul 11, 2006.

  1. TurboT

    TurboT Guest

    What has changed? This is not a netbios/wins/browser occurance.

    Background

    I have 80+ remote offices they are currently workgroup configuration, no
    wins separated across routers not passing broadcast traffic. They did not
    show up in Entire Network yesterday.

    Today we are adding the computers to the domain and they are now showing up
    like browser traffic in the domain under Microsoft Windows network. I do
    not want this and should not been seen at all under Entire Network. It is
    acting just like browser traffic.

    1. All I can think it AD is publishing the computer some how??
    Authenticated users?

    TIA
     
    TurboT, Jul 11, 2006
    #1
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  2. This is the expected behavior. There is a significant difference between
    browsing across subnets with a workgroup configuration and browsing a
    domain:

    http://support.microsoft.com/kb/117633/en-us

    Doug Sherman
    MCSE, MCA, MCP+I, MVP
     
    Doug Sherman [MVP], Jul 12, 2006
    #2
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  3. TurboT

    Turbot Guest

    Doug, thank you for the link, this is true, however this is the way browsing
    works with the master browser etc in a netbios/broadcast world. Across
    subnets with WINS etc. This configuration to the remote offices does not
    have WINS configured, how can they know about each other. Where in active
    directory are client machines knowing who is the domain master browser, MB,
    etc.


    thx
     
    Turbot, Jul 12, 2006
    #3
  4. In a single domain, branch office master browsers use WAN links to send
    lists to the PDC emulator at the central office - not significantly
    different from segment master browsers on a routed LAN. WINS is usually not
    needed unless there are multiple domains or client VPN links.

    Doug Sherman
    MCSE, MCSA, MCP+I, MVP
     
    Doug Sherman [MVP], Jul 12, 2006
    #4
  5. Maybe I didn't really answer your question;

    The SVR record for the pdc is in a child zone of _msdcs.domain.com

    Doug Sherman
    MCSE, MCSA, MCP+I, MVP
     
    Doug Sherman [MVP], Jul 12, 2006
    #5
  6. TurboT

    TurboT Guest

    Doug,

    so amoung the many other things the PDC emulator does for AD this is one of
    them. So just to recap

    1. the PDC emulator becoms the "segment" master browser and popluated with
    the browse list of of the remote offices.. it still seems like there is a
    few other "magic" items that hapen.. but as a side thought then would bring
    me to one other question..

    If I had a pure SMB directed hosted world without netbios anywhere in my
    world would their ever be anything listed in the browser list? I thought AD
    was a passive service and we would have to publish shares/printers etc once
    netbios was truley turned off?

    Any thoughts?

    Thanks for the Brainstorm.
     
    TurboT, Jul 12, 2006
    #6
  7. Yes - the browser service requires NetBIOS - period. In an AD domain all
    clients know where the "PDC" is without WINS or lmhosts files. Oddly, when
    someone wants the result you are getting and is not getting it, I have
    achieved it with lmhosts files.

    Doug Sherman
    MCSE, MCSA, MCP+I, MVP
     
    Doug Sherman [MVP], Jul 12, 2006
    #7
  8. TurboT

    TurboT Guest

    Doug, this last sentence, regarding LMhosts, I agree in a netbios world but
    are you saying in a pure AD world if you use an LMHOSTS file you are getting
    the same results. Even if you have disabled netbios on the machines?
     
    TurboT, Jul 13, 2006
    #8
  9. TurboT

    Bill Grant Guest

    If you have disabled Netbios over TCP/IP on all your machines and you
    are not running any other protocol which supports Netbios names (such as
    Netbeui or IPX),
    then the browser service will not build any browser list anywhere even if it
    is enabled.

    The computer browser service is an NT legacy app and is not aware of
    AD.
     
    Bill Grant, Jul 13, 2006
    #9
  10. NO - you must have NetBIOS to browse - I was just saying that sometimes
    even with NetBIOS browsing doesn't work well and lmhosts files can help.

    Doug Sherman
    MCSE, MCSA, MCP+I, MVP
     
    Doug Sherman [MVP], Jul 13, 2006
    #10
  11. TurboT

    TurboT Guest

    Yes I agree, it has been around since WfW for sure.

    Doug have you ever found a document that indicates what you said about the
    browse list and the PDC emulator?
     
    TurboT, Jul 13, 2006
    #11
  12. Yes - I gave you a link to it in my first reply. Please understand that a
    PDC or a PDC emulator is a Domain Master Browser which can compile a unified
    domain wide browse list from segment master browsers on remote subnets.
    There is no analog to this in a workgroup environment.

    Doug Sherman
    MCSE, MCSA, MCP+I, MVP
     
    Doug Sherman [MVP], Jul 13, 2006
    #12
  13. TurboT

    TurboT Guest

    Yes, I do understand, I just missed that fact that the remote subnet master
    browsers would talk to the PDC but does make complete sense. I was purley
    thinking of the wins world.

    So I need to hide all remote office computers from the browse list, turning
    off netbios is unfortunatly not an option at this point due to applications
    at remote offices.

    My thought.

    1. issue command net config server /hidden:yes

    Do you have any other "elegant" ideas I am all ears.

    TIA ..

    turbot
     
    TurboT, Jul 14, 2006
    #13
  14. TurboT

    TurboT Guest

    Doug, disregard command, should of just done some more digging.

    Thanks for your assistance

    /turbot
     
    TurboT, Jul 14, 2006
    #14
  15. No problem - the article and others often aren't very clear. For example,
    you will see statements such as 'you need WINS to browse remote domains.'
    This is not the same thing as browsing remote subnets in the same domain,
    and sometimes the distinction is only 'implied.'

    Doug Sherman
    MCSE, MCSA, MCP+I, MVP
     
    Doug Sherman [MVP], Jul 14, 2006
    #15
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